Re: Re: [Chrysler300] C-300 value and Torqueflight Swaps

From: "johnl" <john@xxxxxxxxx>

Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2007 15:50:16 -0700

Also you must relocate the rear cross member that supports the rear of the trans by about it's own width. Thus the front will end up where the rear of the powerflite position was. This requires cutting and welding. The driveshaft will end up being shorter as the torqueflite trans is longer. The Imperial shafts are longer than the B as the wheel base is longer. In 1956 the Imperials used a (2) piece shaft with a carrier bearing, so don't go there. Possibly a 1955 Imperial shaft would work once shortened, but without referring to my parts book I can't advise if the u-joints are the same. If you find a good drive line shop the original shaft can be shortened if you wish to retain the '56 rear end. Otherwise the tail u-joint will have to be changed as well if you go to a later 3rd member. One other item to check is the diameter of the B shaft assuming it is the correct one. Others you find may be smaller and not designed for the power a B delivers. This was discovered in our example during restoration and was corrected. The pushbutton station is possibly the most difficult item to find. These were only used late in the production year on Imperials and very few Letter Cars. Over the years I've purchased one extra complete assembly for a backup. I would strongly recommend anyone doing this conversion do the same if possible. For the record our B was modified to the torqueflite back in the early 1960's long before our ownership. In 1987 when the body off restoration was begun I left it. When showing or discussing our car I ALWAYS inform people that this is not correct to this car but it was offered very late in the year to very few cars. This is also stated in writing with documentation that is displayed when the car is. John Lazenby 1955 Chrysler New Yorker Deluxe Town & Country 1955 Imperial Newport 1955 Chrysler C300 Tango Red 1956 Chrysler 300B Cloud White 1957 Chrysler 300C Coupe Raven Black 1960 Chrysler 300F Coupe Alaskan White 1963 Volkswagen Beetle Black 2001 BMW ///M5 (A Modern Super Car) http://www.bmwmregistry.com/model_faq.php?id=18 ----- Original Message ----- From: Roger Schaaf To: fabe7445@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Cc: Chrysler 300 list service Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2007 2:35 PM Subject: Re: Re: [Chrysler300] C-300 value and Torqueflight Swaps You must replace the pushbutton station as the torqueflight has 3 forward positions instead of 2 as on a powerflight. Also you must make accomodation for a longer emergency brake cable and I believe(this was almost 20 years ago) that I had to change the length of the driveshaft. If you find an Imperial with a torqueflight, then this would help you as most parts will just move across. However I am not certain on driveshaft length as not certain if there is a wheelbase difference between a 300 and an Imperial. I also changed to a 2:92 rear axle ratio using a 1957 Chrysler(I knew there was something better on the 300 C's---just kidding folks!) rear end assembly. This definitely requires driveshaft surgery as the year U Joint assembly is different between a 56 pinion yoke and a 57 pinion yoke. The spring perches on the axle is 1/4 inch wider on the 57 assembly which is insignificant as this is only 1/8 inch on each side. It is almost impossible to find that ratio in a 56 rear assembly even though it was claimed that 3:08's were an option in 56. Mainly for Imperials sold in the flatlands of the USA. I looked for several years to no success. This is a great swap and makes the car far more user friendly especially on the highway. The lower 1st gear of the torqueflight still gives you decent off the line acceleration. The stock 56 rear axle ratio of 3:36 had the engine spinning so fast at 70 mph that it sounded as if the solid lifters were swapping holes. Under full acceleration the rear tires will bark when hitting 2nd and 3rd gear. I had Timo give the torqueflight a pretty good work over for me. I am copying the listsrv as there may be others interested in this swap. Just save your old stuff for the purists. Roger Schaaf ----- Original Message ----- From: <fabe7445@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: "Roger Schaaf" <obiwan10@xxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2007 7:06 PM Subject: Re: Re: [Chrysler300] C-300 value?? > Roger, > > When you replaced your powerflite with a torqueflite, did you replace > the pushbuttons station > or did you keep the original BP station ? This is on my want to do list. > > Thanks, Jim Faber 56B >> >> From: "Roger Schaaf" <obiwan10@xxxxxxxxxxx> >> Date: 2007/08/01 Wed PM 03:29:07 EST >> To: <C300@xxxxxxx>, >> <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, >> "johnl" <john@xxxxxxxxx> >> Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] C-300 value?? >> >> John: >> >> I did not mean to imply that this car came from the factory with no >> options and I am not aware that Mr. Astor(current owner of this car) is >> claiming it to be as it came from the factory. If options were in place >> and then removed by some owner, then it now is a zero option(or more >> correctly, without options) car. I am aware that some in our >> organization consider this to be a felony of the highest order(forgetting >> for a moment that a subsequent owner can at his option bring it back to >> "factory") and others merely wish to enjoy their automobiles to be the >> way they want them to be--I replaced my miserable Powerflight with a >> Torqueflight and sin of all sins replaced the bias tires(hell they were >> Remington L 78's anyway and even worse they were DOT approved) with >> Diamondback radials(safety and comfort being more important to me then >> losing a couple of points on some judged event that I never expect to >> experience anyhow). I consider my car to be for my driving enjoyment and >> casual showing rather than a 100 point trailer queen that between shows >> merely deteriorates in my garage. The next owner can do as he >> wishes,,,easily even shove the miserable Powerflight back into it if >> desired. I also own an old Corvette and am a member of NCRS(Corvette >> owner's really anal organization that makes our club--or most any other >> club-- appear truly car enthusiast friendly) and I have installed a Doug >> Nash 5 speed, 1987 16 inch wheels, and a 500 hp 400 ci small block in it. >> It of course drives some members around the bend but its my car and I >> enjoy it the way it is and that it will turn 12 second quarter miles thru >> the exhaust and IMHO looks very nice. It too has no issues that some >> future owner cannot deal with if he wishes. >> >> I truly wonder just how much a modified car really loses in value >> compared to a totally stock(but likely way over restored) car. I suppose >> you could deduct a certain amount for the labor and parts required to >> take it back to stock and most bidders can easily take that into >> consideration when bidding if a "stock" car is their desire. But what I >> have noted at Barrett and other auctions is that the well over restored >> cars always seem to bring the big bucks. The as factory "stock" cars >> when seen under the bright lights just do not seem to excite the bidder's >> paddles to go up as much(3 million dollar Plymouths and Corvette clones >> the exceptions). Also wonder how many Pebble Beach Duisenberg's or old >> Ferrari's are as "factory" when now shown. >> >> I am fairly certain that you and most others of our members probably feel >> as I do on this issue. Else we would not see on our owner's automobiles: >> radial and/or DOT tires, disc brakes, added options, wire wheels, >> Petronix ignitions, Champion spark plugs, 2 stage polyurethane paints, >> Goer's(and others) interiors, after market windshields, and of course not >> to the mention all the cars with perfect door gaps, pristine paint jobs >> with no flaws or orange peel(or have we forgotten just how miserable the >> paint was on some of these old enamel cars?) and undercarriage >> suspensions, frames, engine compartment components all of which are bead >> blasted and painted or more likely powdercoated to perfection---imagine >> the expense to take this back to factory "stock"---. >> >> Oh, yes I was aware that this car began life in Platinum. I too happen >> to believe that there is not a prettier 300 to be found be seen anywhere >> then a red C 300 in Tango Red(especially if well done) so I can fully >> sympathize with Bill Madden's motives(removing PS if that was done, >> aside).. >> >> If you really want to go crazy, check out this website to see what was >> done to Gary Meadors 300 B by Boyd Coddington. I was parked next to Gary >> at a local MOPAR show. I loved the car. This one however would be a >> challenge to take back to "stock" I suppose. >> >> http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=13490&posts=9&mid=75775 >> >> >> Roger Schaaf >> 300 B Calyfornua >> >> . >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: johnl >> To: C300@xxxxxxx ; Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; Roger Schaaf >> Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2007 8:50 AM >> Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] C-300 value?? >> >> >> Hi Roger and all, >> >> I feel it necessary to clear the air here. Your statement reads as: "It >> is a zero option car, no radio,no heater, no pw, ps, pb, nada nada." The >> red '55 you speak of was originally not a red car and did have at least >> some of the options that it no longer possesses. It is examples like this >> that after a period of time are represented as a correct factory car when >> in fact they are not. >> >> Recently I've heard that this very car is on display in a large >> collection in Southern California and is represented as a correct factory >> example, thus the misinformation has already begun. As to value I >> personally would not rate a modified example anywhere close to a >> accurately restored car as it came from the factory. >> >> I have verified the information stated above regarding the example you >> speak of with Gil Cunningham who does the Microfilm Research Archives for >> the Chrysler 300 Club International. >> >> John Lazenby >> >> 1955 Chrysler New Yorker Deluxe Town & Country >> 1955 Imperial Newport >> 1955 Chrysler C300 Tango Red >> 1956 Chrysler 300B Cloud White >> 1957 Chrysler 300C Coupe Raven Black >> 1960 Chrysler 300F Coupe Alaskan White >> 1963 Volkswagen Beetle Black >> 2001 BMW ///M5 (A Modern Super Car) >> http://www.bmwmregistry.com/model_faq.php?id=18 >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Roger Schaaf >> To: C300@xxxxxxx ; Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 2:18 PM >> Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] C-300 value?? >> >> Timo Tanskanen would be as good as you will ever find in Calyfornua. >> However you certainly will be looking at a 100k plus and that would be a >> bargain to have one of the best. I followed very closely the restoration >> of a red 55 that he did for a close friend(Bill Madden) of mine. The car >> is superb. It is a zero option car, no radio, no heater, no pw, ps, pb, >> nada nada. >> >> Timo is now just finishing up for Bill, a 59 black Crown Imperial >> convertible that will have its first showing at Carmel(invitation only) >> next month during the 2 weeks of annual Monterey festivities. I believe >> that this car will be the finest Imperial to be found anywhere. >> >> You are usually far better off to find a finished car unless you enjoy >> the often frustrating birthing process and can willingly endure the death >> of a thousand knives as you write the checks and tell the white lies to >> your spouse about how much this is really going to cost. >> >> Roger Schaaf >> 300 B Calyfornua >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Rich Barber >> To: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >> Sent: Sunday, July 29, 2007 5:50 PM >> Subject: [Chrysler300] C-300 value?? >> >> Any theories on value of a bona fide 1955 Chrysler C-300, rusty, no >> engine, >> most glass good, interior "there"-but ratty, has title? A club member >> has >> it and is sorta thinking $5K-I'm south of that. >> >> And, if I get it, where/who might do a complete body-off-frame resto. >> On the >> left coast. And, of course, I'd need an engine, '55NY block OK for >> starter, >> but would eventually want the 3NEblock, carbs, manifold & batwing. >> >> C-300'ly, >> >> Rich Barber >> >> Brentwood, CA >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------- >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.11.0/927 - Release Date: >> 7/30/2007 5:02 PM >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.11.2/931 - Release Date: 8/1/2007 4:53 PM [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] To send a message to this group, send an email to: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx For list server instructions, go to http://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/ Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Chrysler300/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Chrysler300/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: mailto:Chrysler300-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx mailto:Chrysler300-fullfeatured@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

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