Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update

I did some checking on Rock Auto. For a 61 300, they list a Gabriel Classic #82072 for the front. For the rear there is Gabriel 81469, and Monroe 31131. The Monroe shocks are a little longer than the Gabriels. These same numbers are listed for up to 64 Chrysler, and 66 Imperial. I used the Gabriel fronts and Monroe rears on a 65 Imperial I’m working on. It’s not on the road yet, so I can’t say how it rides. The fronts bolted in with no modifications.

Don

From: mailto:Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2015 5:05 PM

To: Michael Moore ; Thomas Miller

Cc: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; Mark Souders

Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update

The Gabriels have been available for some years now, but when I was searching old posts on our listserver and others a few years ago I saw some concerns that they were too “light duty” for the heavier Chryslers, and especially unsuited for the very heavy Imperials, and references were made that (the rears at least) were valved for the much lighter Dart/Duster/Valiant. Whether or not that is true I don’t know, and I have not tried them myself. Monroe also has an application that fits the rears perfectly with a longer stroke than the KYBs and no leakage issues. I had a “ brand new old” set of Monroes from 1988 that I installed on my ‘57 New Yorker coupe as a temporary measure when the rear KYBs gave out, and they work fine; however, they are not even remotely as “stiff” as the KYBs. They were “made in the USA” back then but I do not know what the quality level is on current stock. Monroe has not had a bolt-in fit for the fronts for at the last 34 years, which is the extent of my ownership of these beasts.

Carl B

300J

From: mailto:Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2015 3:04 PM

To: Thomas Miller

Cc: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; Mark Souders

Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update

I just double checked them by googling that number, followed by Gabriel, then looking at the Sunnit racing ad and clicking

on application. They should fit perfectly, better than KYB I think. I wonder where they have been all these years?

Mike Moore

300H

On Jan 10, 2015, at 12:24 PM, 'Thomas Miller' tfm@xxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

With that information alone, see:

http://gabriel.com/product-search/light-vehicle-detailed-specs/?partnum=82072

http://gabriel.com/product-search/light-vehicle-detailed-specs/?partnum=81469

All sorts of juicy information! :-)

Best Regards,

TFM

>>> "Mark Souders MRS954@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300]" <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> 1/10/2015 3:09 PM >>>

Geez, I'm sitting here thinking I must have missed something. I bought my four shocks from Auto Zone for less than $100 for the set. They bolted right in without any modification. They've been on the car for more than seven years, and I never had a problem with leaks, I rotate my tires each season, and they ride nice.

Front Gabriel 82072 $21.99 each

Rear Gabriel 81469 $24.99 each

Happy Moparing,

Mark

-----Original Message-----
From: John spiers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: John <spiers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Michael Moore <mmoore8425@xxxxxxx>; John Lazenby <french_fryguy@xxxxxxxxx>
Cc: C Bilter <cbilter@xxxxxxxxx>; Don Verity <d.verity@xxxxxxx>; Anna F Noia <sa-noia@xxxxxxxxxxx>; David Schwandt <finsruskw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Bob Jasinski <rpjasin@xxxxxxxxxxx>; Chrysler300 <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sat, Jan 10, 2015 2:15 pm
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update

I can also forward any of the emails from that time regarding the shock absorber conversation to anyone who is interested.

John

From: "John spiers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]" <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: Michael Moore <mmoore8425@xxxxxxx>; John Lazenby <french_fryguy@xxxxxxxxx>
Cc: C Bilter <cbilter@xxxxxxxxx>; Don Verity <d.verity@xxxxxxx>; Anna F Noia <sa-noia@xxxxxxxxxxx>; David Schwandt <finsruskw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Bob Jasinski <rpjasin@xxxxxxxxxxx>; Chrysler300 <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2015 2:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update

Hi all,

On behalf of the Club, back in 2011, I attempted to obtain information from Koni, and had documented interest from members for about +/-30 sets.

The information I was able to get from Koni at that time is that they implied that sets of four shocks would be over $400, and they would have to exceed 100 sets - and even with that, Koni would hesitate, because at that price, they would not be designing a shock from scratch, but altering some existing shock IF they had one close in design. At that price point, interest mostly waned and I let go of the issue.

One route we may want to consider is to cross over the KYB part numbers we are using to Bilstein or Koni - but the same issues as with the KYBs - narrowing the lower front shock mount, and rear shocks having problems at their limit of travel, would need to be addressed. I believe the part numbers we have been using are proper fitment for early 1970s Dodge Challenger and similar Mopars.

John Spiers in sunny 72F Florida

From: "Michael Moore mmoore8425@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300]" <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: John Lazenby <french_fryguy@xxxxxxxxx>
Cc: C Bilter <cbilter@xxxxxxxxx>; Don Verity <d.verity@xxxxxxx>; Anna F Noia <sa-noia@xxxxxxxxxxx>; David Schwandt <finsruskw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Bob Jasinski <rpjasin@xxxxxxxxxxx>; Chrysler300 <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, January 9, 2015 4:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update

John, that would be a great service. It sure seems to me like there is a pretty good production run just waiting to be sold if we counted all the cars, especially Imperials, Dodges and Chryslers up to 73 that they would fit. They don’t need to be bargains either (although that would be nice too.)
Mike Moore
300H
> On Jan 8, 2015, at 8:10 PM, John Lazenby french_fryguy@xxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
> As Mike Moore stated we've had a private conversation and I did provide him the KYB part numbers he purchased and gave him the Summit Racing info to do the research. I have no connection with either Koni or Bilstein and haven't had for years as my company ceased being a distributor for Koni some 28 years ago.
>
> I have no idea how to contact Koni to see what if anything they can offer to custom produce shocks for our cars. Years ago Bilstein was located in the San Diego area and was more receptive to doing custom work. That may or may not be the case today.
>
> I have a close BMW friend that worked for Fox Shocks and I'll check with him as to what they can and or would be willing to do regarding a custom build. I'll see him this weekend.
>
> Last, a thought just occurred in that King Shocks http://www.kingshocks.com/ is in the same complex as Royze, my company. According to my friend that worked for Fox King has done custom work for things like the space shuttle and who knows what else.
>
> Personally I have no experience with Fox or King but I've heard good things about both. I would suggest rather than a bunch of people calling and asking questions let me do a bit of background work first. With luck I can have more info on them soon.
>
> John L.
>
>
>
> On Thursday, January 8, 2015 5:49 PM, C Bilter <cbilter@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
> Last time I looked for shocks I also could not find any current part numbers for ‘55-‘64 Chryslers/Imperials by Koni or Bilstein. John, if you have part numbers this would be most helpful for the club. Or, if the specs have been provided so that the proper fitting high quality shock can be custom crafted by Koni et. al. perhaps a club arrangement could be investigated? Obviously, we would need a certain quantity to get the price point down but it seems a lot of us are in need for some good shocks. Might be a worthwhile club project if someone has the right contacts. I could use a new set of rears to replace the ancient Monroes on my J, and I am hesitant to waste any more money on KYBs. Those of us with Imperials of the same vintage (uses same size shocks), which can weigh up to 1000lbs more than a letter car and have a soft suspension to start with, have an even bigger problem especially with the heavy front end of those beasts.
>
> Carl B
>
> From: mailto:Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2015 5:52 PM
> To: John Lazenby ; Anna F Noia ; David Schwandt ; 'Bob Jasinski' ; 'Chrysler300'
> Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update
>
>
> It would be nice to see the part numbers for these super performance shocks that we are supposed to be able to use on our 300’s. From what I remember, KYB doesn’t even have a listing for 300’s, just a shock number that happens to fit (front) if you grind the lower end to fit the control arm. The rears are probably a little short, but I have yet to change a shock on a car that you could do with the rear end hanging at the end of spring travel. You always have to jack up the rear some. So there are always going to be times when the rear is hanging by the shock. Also, the bumpers on the frame are not there to protect the shock, they are there to keep the rear end from slamming into the frame in an extreme situation.
> Don
>
> From: mailto:Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2015 4:36 PM
> To: Anna F Noia ; David Schwandt ; 'Bob Jasinski' ; 'Chrysler300'
> Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update
>
>
> I may be stirring up something here but I've been in the parts business well over 40 years and have dealt with a lot of performance items including shocks. For my money if you want the best for a basically stock large American car or even a smaller European or Asian example Koni is the way to go. Should you want to go to a "gas" shock Bilstein is probably the best out there.
>
> From that point any brand you choose either in fluid or gas you are going down the ladder in price, quality in design and also performance. Quality cost and you will probably only purchase shocks for your collector car once so you need to make the decision is it price driven or quality first. For my money it is the latter as I find that once they are paid for and installed you tend to forget the cost and are pleased with the results.
>
> Koni shocks are adjustable but not for the reason that many think. To adjust one you must disconnect one end, compress the shock and turn it 1/2 crank and extend it back to increase the dampening. This is designed for wear and not a stiffer ride although many use the adjustment for that. There are six adjustments on a Koni as I recall.
>
> I'm not trying to praise or knock any brand but just tell the facts as I learned over my years. Shocks are something that most won't ever see like a fancy set of tires or wheels but they are a very important part of your car's driveability and safety.
>
> John Lazenby
>
>
> On Thursday, January 8, 2015 1:13 PM, "Anna F Noia sa-noia@xxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]" <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>
> To All
> My two cents worth, the KYB is not a shock I will use (again, used in the past, very dissatisfied). Their shafts are extremely small diameter and are not long enough to do the job needed. The shock should be long enough so the piston does not bottom out before the usable length seen in the vehicle. I appears to me, KYB engineers used a shock with the correct ends for installation, but didn't allow for the physical dimensions needed for the application on Our Chrysler 300's. You need a much stouter heavier duty shock. The Bilstein (sp.?) shock has a main shaft ~2X diameter of the KYB. You need the length and heft of a large diameter shaft for a good sealing surface. Also, the Bilstein has a larger diameter barrel (more fluid). One more point. Check the Fox (or any custom shock builders) Shocks catalog for the required end fittings, and extended length required by our cars. The rear shocks extended length is critical. Again, KYB's are not a good investment, very light duty (IMHO), check other sources. Especially if you push your car into the corner at speed, Good Luck.
>
> Best Regards,
> Stephen A. Noia
> 1-408-210-4736 cell
>
>
> On Thursday, January 8, 2015 12:08 PM, "'David Schwandt' finsruskw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]" <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>
> Well, I do not have a lift and both times mine leaked was when I raised one side, like you were going to change a tire.
>
> Come to think of it, that’s exactly what I was doing.
>
> Maybe on a lift, where you unloaded the springs both at the same time is different.
>
> Sorry to have maybe unduly alarmed some folks.
>
> From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?] On Behalf Of 'Bob Jasinski' rpjasin@xxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2015 12:29 PM
> To: 'David Schwandt'; 'Chrysler300'
> Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update
>
> So Dave, if that's the case, just how are you supposed to raise the car on a lift? Like to rotate tires or do brake work? I have a lift here, and KYBs on my 300G for at least 7 years. No shock oil leaks that I see.
>
> Bob J
>
> From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?] On Behalf Of 'David Schwandt' finsruskw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2015 8:29 AM
> To: 2HsandaHeritage@xxxxxxxxxxx; 'Chrysler300'
> Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update
>
> Dou, Ya just gotta pull it out while the shock is extending If I recall.
>
> It’s just a plastic strap
>
> Make sure you have it aimed at the hole on the tower.
>
> On the rears, DO NOT jack up the car by the frame and let the rear end hang from the shocks!!
>
> They will begin to leak! BTDT!! TWICE already
>
> Dave Schwandt
>
> From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?] On Behalf Of 2HsandaHeritage@xxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2015 10:12 AM
> To: Chrysler300
> Subject: [Chrysler300] KYB Shock Install Update
>
> I have a question for the author of the KYB Shock Install Update.
>
> After the wire is clipped, how do you remove it from on top of the rubber bushing that is now under pressure?
>
> Doug Warrener
>
> Fair Oaks, CA
>
> 300H
>
> 62 - 300 Sport Conv.
>
> PS - my new set of gray KYB's are also not compressed.
>
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