----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2016 9:49
PM
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] Transmission
cooling line failure inside radiator
Hi Ron -
Thanks for your thoughts. I have never seen what's inside my
radiator, especially at the bottom where the transmission oil cooling function
occurs. I pictured a labyrinth of tubing in the bottom "tank" of the
radiator, where the tubing is exposed to the relatively cooler water in the
radiator, just before the coolant is discharged out the bottom. And I
pictured that the rupture would have occurred in some portion of the tubing,
leading to transmission fluid leakage into the coolant while the transmission
is operating and those lines were pressurized. Or is my visualization
incorrect?
The radiator had been rebuilt less than one hour operating time before this
event, although I have no idea what they did inside, especially at the
bottom. They may not have even looked at that part of the
radiator! So, the radiator is coming out and going to the (supposedly)
best place in town, and I want to watch just what they are doing every
step of the way! I may even ask if they can rebuild it to a 4-core
configuration instead of the stock 3-core version. And of course, I'll
be especially interested in seeing what goes on in that bottom tank with the
transmission cooling lines.
After draining everything from the transmission pan, we put a blow-gun all
over every tranny part accessible with the pan removed, (including valve body
and now-empty torque converter), and then we even put a big desiccant
bag in the bottom of the pan where the filter used to reside, closed it up and
left it there for two days. Also blew out the new stainless lines from
the transmission forward to the radiator.
Next plan for cooling system after rebuilt radiator (top, middle and
bottom!) is reinstalled: we will put some degreaser (Awesome, Simple
Green, Purple Power, etc.) into the radiator water while we begin the
transmission refill process. Then run it for a couple of hot/cold
cycles, then drain out the transmission fluid. Rinse and repeat.
Plan to fill and drain the transmission at least twice to flush out any
residual water. Also plan to fill and drain the radiator (and entire
cooling system as best we can) at least twice, leaving heater in "ON" position
to get everything out of there, too. Finally, refill radiator ith
conventional 50/50 green antifreeze (plus Redline WaterWetter) and keep and
eye on everything from temperature to possible pink oily slime on top of
radiator water! Change again if necessary.
Then, just cross fingers (arms, legs, toes and eyes, too!) and hope the
brief exposure to water (with EvapoRust) did not damage anything inside the
zero-hour rebuilt transmission!
I will keep the membership posted on the progress (success or failure) of
this miserable problem!
Ray Melton
1957 300C convert
Las Cruces, NM (575)642-3151
*************************************************************************************************************
On 6/7/2016 6:04 AM, Ron Waters wrote:
Ray -
Job One would be to have a quality radiator
shop rebuild your radiator. There is a breech between the cooling tank on
the bottom and the radiator core itself. Your radiator is toast. Be sure to
get a warranty as well.
There is no need to jury rig auxiliary tranny coolers,
etc. Once you have a new radiator, the system will work as expected.
Removal of coolant from transmission: I would drop the
pan and let all fluid drain out. Also drain out the torque converter. Let
everything drain for a while. Then refill with fresh tranny fluid. You
may want to work the car through the gears a few times. Then shut engine off
and drain the tranny again. Then refill with fresh fluid again.
Removal of tranny fluid from coolant: Drain out
cooling system, which may include heater core if that was connected to the
system. Add a weak solution of coolant and water (I wouldn't run pure water
thru the engine). Get engine up to operating temperature. Then cool down and
drain cooling system. Refill with fresh coolant 50/50 mix and you should be
in good shape.
Ron
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 06, 2016 6:15
PM
Subject: [Chrysler300] Transmission
cooling line failure inside radiator
I have transmission fluid contaminating the cooling system,
and water contaminating the fluid in the transmission! Seeking
Advice. How to decontaminate transmission and entire cooling
system.
Description of problem: After manually
refilling the Type F fluid (about 10 quarts) in the newly rebuilt
Torqueflite in my 1957 300C, we came back the next morning to find a big
pool of water and transmission fluid under the car! They removed the
transmission pan, which let out a considerable amount of water and oil
mix. The Torque converter was completely drained. There were
remnants of pink oil visible on the cooling passages when the radiator cap
was removed. The radiator was drained of the remaining oil and water
mixture.
It was quickly concluded that the
tubing for transmission fluid at the bottom of the radiator had
ruptured internally while the engine was being run to perform the fluid
fill process, pumping high-pressure pink fluid into the radiator water
while running. But after shutting down for the night, the heavier
water pushed back through the (now unpressurized) ruptured oil cooler line
inside the radiator, which eventually pushed oil and water out some
overflow location near the back end of the
transmission.
The transmission was being run in
Neutral, Drive and Reverse during the fluid fill process, so we were
unwittingly getting some water back into the ruptured oil line as soon as
the engine was shut down and the transmission coolant line
pressure went to zero. Then as soon as the engine was
restarted, we were pumping some oil into the radiator and also pumping
some oil/water mix through the transmission.
The entire
cooling system (radiator, all hoses, all water passages in the engine
block and heads, etc.) is now contaminated with at least some amount
of transmission fluid, so I am seeking advice on how to best remove that
oily residue. We plan to blow out the transmission fluid lines
at the bottom of the radiator to remove as much residual fluid as we
can, and then just cap off the inlet and outlet lines, so there will no
longer be the original oil/water heat exchanger functionality. (That
transmission fluid cooing aspect will be addressed separately)
Our tentative plan is to refill the radiator with a mixture
of water and a water-based degreaser like Simple Green, or Purple Power,
then run the engine until it's good and warm, then drain out all the
coolant with solvent and oily contaminant. We will probably do the
solvent flush routine until we see no further trace evidence of
transmission oil in the water coolant -- at least twice -- and then refill
with distilled water and a water-based rust remover called Evapo-Rust to
remove some of the rust that is most certainly all through the
internal coolant passages after the vehicle sat idle for 17
years. I was planning to run that rust-remover coolant
combination for several hours, or at least half a
dozen hot/cooldown cycles before going with a more permanent
water and antifreeze mixture for everyday driving.
What to you guys think of that plan to remove residual
tranny oil from the coolant system?
We plan to connect the
transmission cooling lines to an external auxiliary oil-to-air
transmission cooler that will be located in some open space
roughly in front of the bottom of the radiator wherever it looks like
there might be some air circulation path. I was not planning
to have any fan-forced airflow device, relying just on convective cooling
from a fairly generous finned heat exchanger in whet will likely be a
rather turbulent air flow region (but I have NO way of knowing
that!) I don't know what temperature the transmission fluid would
like to be when it goes back into the tranny after the cooling process,
although I suspect it would be somewhat higher than the temperature in the
radiator, around 190 F as governed by the thermostat. I will
have no reasonable way to tell what the oil temp is when exiting the
auxiliary heat exchanger, so I won't know if the heat exchanger is
doing a good enough job. I know the air temperature will usually be
considerably cooler than the 190-degree water in the radiator, but I also
know that the heat exchange coefficient of the oil-to-air cooler is much
lower than the HX coefficient of the original oil/water cooler
system.
What do you think of the oil-to-air
auxiliary heat exchanger idea to replace the original oil-to-water
system? Any thoughts or advice are welcomed!
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