RE: [Chrysler300] Pont-à-Mousson Black F Convertible

["Carl cbilter@xxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]" <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Just passing this along, as I have no personal knowledge on the Petty F convertible, but wanted to mention that it was extensively discussed on the Facebook page known as “the Chrysler 300 Appreciation Society” back in late December.   In that discussion, one of our former Club members, a very knowledgeable gentleman with extensive experience with Forward Look Mopars and former 300 F Special owner, emphatically stated that the subject car was cloned from a standard black 375hp F convertible with long rams.   And that he “ personally saw the car in storage with that equipment at DP's old salvage yard.”    

Carl B. 

From: 'John Grady' jkg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2020 1:13 PM
To: 'william ELDER'; kmaniak@xxxxxxx; nick@xxxxxxxx; chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] Pont-à-Mousson Black F Convertible

  
While not knowing enough to say anything on the subject at hand re: "who did what, when" , I could understand maybe someone with connections or $ going for a 400HP engine and 4 spd stick in an F convertible ,--- but not with AC? Makes no sense? Smells like a personal resto mod, from one who has done that , at times. 

Chrysler would never do that, ?? and I doubt a sharp 3 rd party making Daytona race cars would either. Opposite goals. And a hassle too , with slightly different 400HP engine parts and tune. Unless someone at race car co --or doing conversions wanted that ? CEO or something? Otherwise how would you ever get all those 400HP specific items in 1960 just as car came out, if done at that time ? 

I once , very long ago, early 70's? bought the perfect interior including consoles from an F that had been totaled in Connecticut, maybe from an magazine ad. ("hit a tree at high speed" , owner of the seats said " could not junk that fantastic interior", so guy hung it on nails in his barn) , console had the shifter cutout and trim plate around it that matched ash tray etc.. also two small round instruments , maybe oil pressure , holes were die stamped , not cut ; also had aluminum shiny metal trim around seat bottoms, not the black plastic. But exact same shapes.. not hand made. So ,real? Prototype? Never finished that story....no numbers....

Kind of funny, also got a ?convertible F quarter panel once from a Mopar guy in NY who had made a basement bar out of it...light even went on...

On the other hand, re: AC, I went down to buy a hemi Challenger convert new in 1970 (company car!--not my $ ) , I was emphatically told no AC with a Hemi , maybe not with six pack either(do not remember on that ) so ended up with nice bronze RT convert with a 440 twin snorkel type hood, 440 legend there on hood ....and air.. Just sayin..no AC in an ultimate performance car.. 

14 gallon tank and 440 would not get me even the 120 miles of mass turnpike to the NY line .....so, two years later, a black 70 Imperial 2 dr 440 coupe, fantastic car... ----got old or something. 

John

-----Original Message-----
From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of 'william ELDER' belder@xxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2020 12:33 PM
To: kmaniak@xxxxxxx; nick@xxxxxxxx; chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] Pont-à-Mousson Black F Convertible

While we are speaking about rare one off 300s, here is a story that Don Rook told me years ago:

In my early years in the club, there were rumours about a second 300 Hurst convertible. When Don lived in Pennsylvania, he was walking through a salvage yard, which he often did; looking for parts. In this particular yard, which was located somewhere near the old Hurst headquarters, he came across the wreck of what appeared to be a 300 Hurst convertible. This car had been in a massive front end collision and was never going to be salvageable. Don’s thought was that he would buy the car, not because he wanted to clone it; but because if somewhere in the future a second 300 Hurst convertible made an appearance, he would have the evidence to dispute the authenticity of any such car. In those days there were dishonest dealers who were cloning 300s to make a fast dollar. Don knew the owner of the yard and he had done business with him many times before. When he approached the yard owner, about buying the old Chrysler convertible in the back, the owner emphatically denied that there was any such car back there. Don protested; but the owner said “Don, just forget that you ever saw that car.” So, Don left; but he continued to wonder about the car and why the yard owner was so upset. Eventually, Don heard a rumour that involved a married Hurst executive, a secretary, a wrecked company car and a scandal coverup.

Sometime went by and Don heard that the salvage yard was being sold to make room for some development. All the cars were to be crushed. Don went back to the yard and asked about the wrecked Chrysler. After some more talking and price negotiation, the yard owner finally told him to get the car out of there and it had to be done, immediately. Don had no way of moving the car back to his house right that second. He did know an elderly lady near the yard, who had a garage that he could rent. He paid the lady, in advance for the rental of her garage for a year. The salvage yard wrecker towed the Chrysler, the short distance to her house and it was backed into her garage. Some months later, Don made arrangements for some one to retrieve the car. When he went to the house the lady had passed away, the house had been sold and there was no car in the garage. End of story.

This is exactly how Don told it to me. If he told any other club members and I can’t imagine that he didn’t, could you please let me know. I didn’t dream it and I didn’t make it up. Of course, it is many years later and no second 300 Hurst convertible has ever made an appearance, except for the made up one, that the owner has full disclosure on.

300ly

bill 

From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of kmaniak@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
Sent: February 11, 2020 11:02 AM
To: nick@xxxxxxxx; chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] Pont-à-Mousson Black F Convertible

Thank you for the update. Nice to know that his white 300F special hardtop is still intact. 

Since all 300F specials were converted by Chrysler after the assembly line, there is no way to verify if any of the existing cars were converted by third party, except through documented history. Whether the black 300F special convertible was Chrysler converted in 1960 or converted later by a third party, it is what it is now and just as distinctive in it's own right.

Chris the K MANIAC

-----Original Message-----
From: nick@xxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: 'Chrysler 300 List' <chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sat, Feb 8, 2020 9:37 pm
Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] Pont-à-Mousson Black F Convertible

He displays the car with a sign on it stating the following:

1960 CHRYSLER 300 F SPECIAL

4-SPEED CONVERTIBLE

1 OF 2 EVER EQUIPPED WITH:

FRENCH PONT-A-MOUSSON TRANS. &

APPROX. 450 H.P. CROSS RAM INDUCTED 413 C.I. ENGINE

COMPLETE FRAME-OFF RESTORATION IN 2006

OWNER: DON PETTY

That sure sounds like a claim that it’s a factory 4-speed convertible. Or at the very least, very misleading. 

Nick.

From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of John spiers@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 4:45 PM
To: Chrysler 300 List <chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] Pont-à-Mousson Black F Convertible

FYI, 

I was at Don's house in 2014. He had both the white 4-speed coupe and the black 4-speed convertible at that time.. 

He did not claim the convertible was an original 4sp car, only that when that he bought the car, it had all the rare 4speed parts in the trunk, including the bellhousing, transmission and headers. The parts possibly came from a Facel-Vega or maybe a factory-built 4-speed 300F otherwise lost.

Maybe not original, but I wouldn't mind owning it.

John Spiers 

On Fri, Feb 7, 2020 at 1:55 PM, kmaniak@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300]

<Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

A little history on Don Petty. Over 30 years ago, Don Petty owned what I believe was the only other surviving 300F special of the original 7. It was a white hardtop. Now that the black 300F special convertible has appeared in his possession, the white 300F hardtop has since disappeared. Coincidence? I think not. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Rinaldi awrdoc@xxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: Chrysler 300 List <chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sat, Feb 1, 2020 9:28 am
Subject: [Chrysler300] Pont-à-Mousson Black F Convertible

Hi To All,

In this month’s Hemmings Bible there is a 2 page spread re a 4 speed Pont-à-Mousson black F convertible. 

I searched the Hemmings site and found the full original article from 2017. 

A CHRYSLER 300F CONVERTIBLE PACKING A RARE FOUR-SPEED MANUAL GEARBOX

By Jeff Koch from the June 2017 issue of Hemmings Muscle Machines

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/article/headless-horsepower-1960-chrysler-300f/ 

The car was owned by Don Petty, brother of Lee Petty. 

Previously, there was a white F GT owned by Tom Turner?

Some say the Petty car was made up?

Whatever the case, the article is quite informative. 

Enjoy reading about the details of the GT 300 racing legends and how Chrysler got around the rules by hiding the fact that the GTs were “factory supported.”

Tony

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

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Posted by: "william ELDER" <belder@xxxxxxxxx>
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Posted by: Carl <cbilter@xxxxxxxxx>
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