RE: {Chrysler 300} Re: [Chrysler300] Need modern PPG code for 1957 "Gaug

Rich and all:

I was in the same boat as you, when I was trying to come up with the same color, Roman Red Poly, for my K. In order to get a color match, we had the paint supply shop scan the top of the radiator support. I had every reason to believe this part had never been tampered with and it had rarely been exposed to sunlight. It was a match for the firewall and inner fender panels that, also have never been painted. The paint supply shop, renowned for being the best supplier in this area, came up with a modern color match. Cardinal Red Metallic, for a 1988 to 89 Honda, color code R66M-3, paint GenMix Pro.

You can see the color match between the fender and the radiator support, still in its original paint.

Regards

bill

From: chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of Rich Barber
Sent: November 17, 2020 2:05 AM
To: chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; 'Ray Melton' <rfmelton@xxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: {Chrysler 300} Re: [Chrysler300] Need modern PPG code for 1957 "Gauguin Red"" paint

Ray and all:

I would guess that most of those trying to match old paint with new formulation will or have run into the same surprising brick wall that there is no chart matching old formulations to new—even at the same dealer/brand source. I ran into that with my ’64 300K in Roman Red “Poly”. I was able to borrow a dealer’s body color book which had rather large and glossy color samples in it. The painter scanned the T-code Roman Red sample in the book and came up with a standard current formula with the closest match to the color sample. It does not generate a new formula, but matches the color of the sample to the closest existing formula in their database of a broad range of current and recent vehicles. I regret I have misplaced the year, make , model and paint name the computer came up with but I think it was to a Mercedes-Benz color. Later, I did take a picture of a M-B in a closely-matching color-picture attached. What the computer does not match is the amount and particle size of the “poly” or aluminum powder. I had the painter cut the powder way back from the original formula and darkened the formula a little but now feel the original formula had very little “poly” and that our car now has too much. It is much shinier and of a slightly-different hue than the firewall which was not repainted. Oh, well..I tried. Attached are pictures of an M-B SLK 320—possibly a 2003 in Magma Red, our 300K convertible and a Google image of another 300K convertible. Internet pictures can be off a country mile but I believe all three are in the same color family. Another comparison can be found at: https://www.uniquecarsandparts.com.au/colour_swatch_mercedes_2003

My previous 300 was a 1955 C-300 that was an early Platinum car that had been repainted by the previous owner and was a more “whiter” white than the original “Platinum” At the OK meet we had my C-300 (too light), another member’s C-300 who had tried very hard to match its original Platinum (too dark) and another member’s C-300 (probably just about right).

Just a suggestion for what its worth. I’m aware the club has master samples of some or all letter-car paint shades. These are the original formula paint sprayed on 3”-4” steel squares and are used to evaluate the paint in the concours judging. It would be helpful if these standards could be “shot” by a good shop and one or more closely matching make, year and color name established and made available to members. How far to tilt the “poly” can.

In the end, color matching is challenging and needs current technology, a cooperative paint shop and someone with a reputable standard and a great eye for color. I’m told, and believe, women have much better color discernment than men. In this day and age, I would expect better technology but I am glad to note that it is more of an art.

We bought our present house here in CA new in 1998. Had it repainted with the same formula five years later and now find nothing but water-base, non-volatile paint and the same story. When I go to the same paint dealer, they have no clue to translate the old formula to the new. They also scan and then use female eyes to tweak the closest match the computer comes up with. I found that they could have the correct tint but not the depth of color. In order to get the best match for touchup paint,, they added additional tinting fluid in the same proportion.

Best wishes for a color that closely matches the club standard.

Rich Barber

Brentwood, CA

From: chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of ALLAN POZDOL
Sent: Monday, November 16, 2020 5:38 PM
To: Ray Melton <rfmelton@xxxxxxx>; chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: {Chrysler 300} Re: [Chrysler300] Need modern PPG code for 1957 "Gauguin Red"" paint

Hi Ray,

Try these folks. They are expert at mixing modern paints to paints of yesteryear. Look around their web site.

It is true talent to match the colors of days gone by. The modern paint tinters change every few years, but these guys nail it repeatedly!

https://tcpglobal.com/pages/restoration-shop

They matched my color book of post war Jaguar nitro colors EXACTLY. In shade and sunlight.

Allan

On 11/16/2020 7:28 PM Ray Melton rfmelton@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Hello, fellow COVID shut-ins -

The marginally competent and minimally cooperative PPG paint distributor
here in the nearby city (El Paso, TX) is unable to mix up some Gauguin
Red (Chrysler code "P") touch-up paint for my 1957 300C.   I even
brought them a can with some (hardened and useless) paint left over from
when my late father had the car painted in 1975 - The can was labeled
"Ditzler" with a code of DQE 70693 and had a generous drip on the
outside that showed the color. Internet search shows that the old
Ditzler code corresponds directly to PPG code 70693, but the local
dealer says that number only leads them to an obsolete industrial enamel
formulation which they cannot translate into their modern chemistry.
The PPG guy basically threw up his hands and said, "Sorry, can't help
you with that number; just bring the car down so we can scan it with our
computer."   That's a 100-mile trip I don't care to make, and risk
exposing the car to the traffic and drivers there in El Paso. They also
wanted to give me grief for insisting on a single-stage paint, touting
the superior super-glossy base/clear systems now in favor - they
couldn't understand why anyone would want that old formulation and are
obviously not attuned to the vintage car restoration market, whatsoever!

Can anyone help these guys at PPG translate that old number into their
modern system, perhaps with detailed formulation, such as 3.2 red; 0.1
yellow; .5 black, etc.? I'm looking for a single-stage enamel, and I
think I heard the PPG guy say "Omnicolor".    My painter wants to stay
with PPG because he's familiar with all the thinners and hardeners,
drying times, temperature/humidity adjustments, etc., so doesn't want to
go to a different brand of paint. This is for a small area touch-up, so
I don't need much.

Any specific ideas would be appreciated.

Ray Melton Las Cruces, NM      1957 300C cvt white/Gauguin s/n
3N572517
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Posted by: Ray Melton <rfmelton@xxxxxxx>

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RE: {Chrysler 300} Re: [Chrysler300] Need modern PPG code for 1957 "Gauguin Red"" paint.