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I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!
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61plymy
Posted 2010-05-06 11:21 PM (#222095)
Subject: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.

What the hell? Doesn't this region do anything?? Is Docs new garage the only activity we can muster?? Isn't there ANYONE that can get off their ass and actually post something of value here, so we don't appear so lame to entire FRIGGIN' WORLD??

I am so ashamed. 

 

Mike

 

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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-06 11:54 PM (#222107 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
I'm building the beam pockets for my monster ridge beam this w/e. Boom truck comes around the 15th. Not sure what else
you want. Besides you and me, is there anyone else here with a pulse ?


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56royaldodge
Posted 2010-05-07 6:24 AM (#222121 - in reply to #222107)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Account deactivated by owner's request

1000500100100100100
Location: On this barrel
maybe I should post the results from my last proctology visit?
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-07 12:53 PM (#222150 - in reply to #222121)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
A nice photo spread would be sweet !
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-07 12:56 PM (#222151 - in reply to #222150)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Mikey ~ We are doomed.

Mention Forward Look to this crowd and the first response beyond you and me is a tour of someone's rectal canal.

What kind of crew are we courting here, anyway ?


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floyd066
Posted 2010-05-07 1:15 PM (#222156 - in reply to #222151)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Extreme Veteran

Posts: 347
10010010025
Location: Ocean Park, Washington
I'm in Vancouver, Wa and wish there were FL cars in this area. I went and met the WPC club in this area a couple years ago and it didn't feel right for me.
My ride will be changed in different ways which doesn't meet with the WPC club.
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wizard
Posted 2010-05-07 1:46 PM (#222162 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+

Posts: 13045
500050002000100025
Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island
It's not the region that sucks friends, it's more about that some people just not are into participating in a forum. Some people does not want to share knowledge and experience, while some others does not think that they have anything worth to share. Look at my region - I do most of the posting there, really! I trie to motivate our members but I fail to make posts that will engage people and interest them to participate. I think we should all be happy that we have an overall large number of poster that is making this forum a great place. Don't forget that we, as a group posesses the largest FL knowledge alive today and that really counts for our newbie tenderfoots as well as for us seniors - I get AHA sensations every day here and I hope that this count for all of us.

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56royaldodge
Posted 2010-05-07 2:37 PM (#222167 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Account deactivated by owner's request

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Location: On this barrel
Here is my meger contribution. The attached picture shows my 56 Dodge which I paid $500 for ... factory paint, no rust. It hasn't moved with its own power since 1992 when it broke a connecting rod ... because I was a stupid high school kid who abused it.

The foreground shows that one of my children decided to put a can of tomatoes in my vise.

Around here you never see forwardlook cars.



(car.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments car.jpg (56KB - 698 downloads)
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-07 3:00 PM (#222173 - in reply to #222167)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
I have my eye on a 56 CRL sedan that was a D-500 car. Someone nabbed the engine and the kid that owns/owned it has a
marine 383 sitting loose in the engine bay ... at least that is what he told me it is. I could really use a few parts he has, but
am reluctant to part this car, being a genuine D-500. The "kid" swallowed a shotgun last fall and the car is just sitting, the old
man has cancer, and I am torn about what to do.

With my shop under construction,I need another distraction and expense like I need another hole in my head, but as we all
know, you have to jump on things when they come up. Anyone want to build a D-500 sedan ? Maybe go in on the deal so the
car gets saved ? It does have some lower quarter rust and the potmetal is pretty rough.
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Rebels-59
Posted 2010-05-07 4:40 PM (#222192 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+

500050002000500
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
GUYS,, You should move to Netherland.. As the Nether Region is normally Buzzing.................. LMAO
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56royaldodge
Posted 2010-05-07 6:43 PM (#222212 - in reply to #222192)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Account deactivated by owner's request

1000500100100100100
Location: On this barrel
I ban the next person who posts a message to this thread.
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safetymike77
Posted 2010-05-07 7:37 PM (#222219 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Expert

Posts: 4533
2000200050025
Location: Ripon, WI
Good god... Hey Doc, you still have that white coronet for sale?
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-07 8:34 PM (#222227 - in reply to #222219)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Sure do. Had a lot of queries with an "I'll get back to ya" that never happens. I assume most
times it involves a hefty shipping problem ? Whatever, it is a pretty nice car for little scratch,
and a rare model too. It ain't like I am trying to get rich off the $#@! thing. What else cool
can be had for $1500 in this kind of condition ? Go figger !
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safetymike77
Posted 2010-05-07 9:17 PM (#222234 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Expert

Posts: 4533
2000200050025
Location: Ripon, WI
Well, I will be searching for something fun to play with....
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floyd066
Posted 2010-05-07 11:40 PM (#222244 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Extreme Veteran

Posts: 347
10010010025
Location: Ocean Park, Washington
cool, some action in this thread!!
I've only been in this forum for a short while and will contact a couple of FLers in the "Couve" to join this site.
One has a 56 Chrysler Windsor like mine and the other has a 57 Dodge.
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-08 1:22 AM (#222255 - in reply to #222234)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
safetymike77 - 2010-05-08 6:17 PM

Well, I will be searching for something fun to play with....


*********************************************

It is this cop car EXACTLY .... WE code, no side trim at all. Not available for purchase to the public.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrKXQ3Qmq5o

Could be a very fun car to "play" with.
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61plymy
Posted 2010-05-10 1:45 PM (#222572 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
I'd much rather see the car action than the proctology action, as I've had more than my share of butt cams in recent years. That can of tomatoes stuff in the vice might be cool though.

Doc, I'd just give Neil the tip on the D-500 car and let him show us how it SUPPOSED to be done. If you did it yourself, you know he and his posse will just tear it to pieces. If he doesn't save it himself, I think he has no further business mouthing off on others cars in the future. Might be a two-bird situation there.

We need a Region "Big To Do". Somewhere sorta-kinda-central. Snohomish is too far North. Who's central and can help put something together? I'll help if someone bites. Otherwise, I'm putting our region in for the Biggest Fat Ass's of the Year award in the Couch Potato International competition.

Mike
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-10 10:54 PM (#222692 - in reply to #222572)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
You guys and your Neil-bashing fetish. I have an easier time understanding Josef Mengele than I do this.

My roof beam arrives sometime around the 15th. I will begin setting rafters im-midget-ly and WILL have a f!cking
roof on before winter. I also vow to have a slab floor poured too. If I do not take the Afghan deployment before then,
mebbe we can whoop it up here ? Central ? .... What is "central" to our region ?

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56royaldodge
Posted 2010-05-11 12:35 PM (#222754 - in reply to #222692)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Account deactivated by owner's request

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Location: On this barrel
Doctor DeSoto - 2010-05-10 8:54 PM

Central ? .... What is "central" to our region ?



Kennewick
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-11 1:54 PM (#222762 - in reply to #222754)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Do we have an active member in the Kenny-wick area ?
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61plymy
Posted 2010-05-11 7:34 PM (#222832 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
I PM'd our (ahem) moderator regarding a description of our region borders. He has not deigned to respond as yet, so I have no friggin' idea where "Central" is.

All I know is it goes from Canada down to at least Big M's yard, but no idea how east it goes.

Mike
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chrysler300c
Posted 2010-05-12 1:02 AM (#222898 - in reply to #222762)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Expert ,, George Passed away July 28th 2021, He will be Missed

Posts: 1295
1000100100252525
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho
I think so. His name is Bill Leahy in Kennewick.

George
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-12 12:01 PM (#222951 - in reply to #222898)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Bill must keep pretty quiet. Never heard of him.

So, who's gonna tell Bill we're all coming to his place for a party ?
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61plymy
Posted 2010-05-12 9:42 PM (#223087 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
OK, you guys,

Turns out we have no idea where our region borders are.

North Cal, Or, WA for sure but what about Idaho, North Nevada?

Anyone have any thoughts?

How in the hell did we get a region but not have a clue where and who was in it?? Did the Gummint set this one up or what?

Give us yer thoughts, Whatever we decide will go into a sticky so a guy in the future can figure out if he is cool or not (being cool would be in as opposed to out, for those who were wondering).

Keep in mind that it is more difficult to handle a really big area as opposed to a smaller one, and also that the more the merrier.

Myself, I'd go for all of the above, IF the Idaho and North Nevada folks want to be cool. But then you have to draw a line in the sand in south Northern Cal and south Northern Nevada.

I have driven down to Big M's yard and that is not just a quick weekend drive from Snohomish (although that's how I did it with my brother).

Spill yer beans, guts, and beer about it here.

Mike
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56royaldodge
Posted 2010-05-12 10:08 PM (#223093 - in reply to #223087)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Account deactivated by owner's request

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Location: On this barrel
I'm OK with that ....

Next phase is thinking of a date when we can all meet ... Something like (me tellin the wife because the next centry is planned) "darlin ... Doc Desoto found out he has cancer of the 'you know whats', I HAVE to drive up there this summer to drink his beer while he finishes his shop, If I don't show up his Desoto will be sent to the crusher minutes before he dies, in plain view of him" !!!! FOR THE LOVE OF GOD! Don't make me start crying.

Edited by 56royaldodge 2010-05-12 10:10 PM
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61plymy
Posted 2010-05-13 11:39 AM (#223145 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
It's OK, Robert. We all cry at the prospect of free beer from time to time.

Mike
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-05-13 1:34 PM (#223168 - in reply to #223145)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
No cancer, but I do have a case of Kokanee in the auxillary (sic?) reefer and I spent a chunk of yesterday
surgically removing two stud (16' walls) to place the beam posts. Git everything marked and will install the
post today. Might even tip a couple of those barley-pops in the process ? Beam is supposed to be here
between the 12th and 15th. Plenty going on in MY region !
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deloverly
Posted 2010-05-23 10:56 PM (#224867 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Elite Veteran

Posts: 755
5001001002525
Location: Big M Automotive's Yard
Big Party at the M! Actually I'm having a 50th birthday party for John on November 6, 2010.

If that won't work, let us know and we will try our best to participate. WE ARE NOT AFRAID OF ROAD TRIPS!!

M'Lisa
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-06-24 12:45 AM (#229360 - in reply to #222107)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Looks like our flurry of not sucking has petered out.


Edited by Doctor DeSoto 2010-06-24 12:46 AM
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61plymy
Posted 2010-06-24 12:24 PM (#229410 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
That's because we suck at not sucking.

Mike
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-06-24 10:39 PM (#229512 - in reply to #229410)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Relish in the shame !
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Dave L.
Posted 2010-06-28 2:57 AM (#229964 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Extreme Veteran

Posts: 340
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Location: Tacoma, WA
Tacoma checking in. Crazy busy and pulse weak. Plus only a non-running project car until finances catch up. (Can't even swing the white coronet.) I know at least one other posting and driving member in town though. I've been too busy and haven't been to anything since the 300 meet here a while back. I got to Ellensburg too late to make it to the WPC meet this weekend ... I forgot about it until last minute and didn't post it. Well, there's a big all-years MoPar show August 22, 2010, and I'll post that later. Umm... the LeMay Museum finally broke ground, and consensus is that it will look like a giant grub worm. Do I get a royal banning for following up?

Edited by Dave L. 2010-06-28 3:15 AM
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-07-05 9:10 PM (#231213 - in reply to #229964)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Sorry to break the suckingness, but this region just awarded me another side job that should see
the shop roof through to completion. I'll get the side job all wrapped up before starting the work,
but will post pix as it goes down. After the roof is on, pour the slab, and the DeSoto project is back
on track !!!


Edited by Doctor DeSoto 2010-07-05 9:11 PM
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-07-10 12:45 PM (#231887 - in reply to #231213)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
I have been out working on my side job in the evenings after work. Got a few more days before it is done.
Last night I headed home, ... the air was thick with the smells of the pine forests, grassy fields, aspen stands,
and even the lake I passed. Every twist in the road was heaven on the nose. The weather has been divine and
in spite of our region sucking, I am having a great summer and every day gets me one step closer to my goals.


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61plymy
Posted 2010-07-11 4:30 PM (#232063 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
Doc,

Our Summer on the wrong side of the Cascades is like our region so far. It sucks. Finally a few straight days of heat, sun, and projects. Won't last though. We suck too bad for it too last.

Dave L is chomping at the bit to do follow up so he can earn a banning (A Royal Banning I think he said). I vote we let him do the followup and dispense with the Royal Banning he has asked for. If we give him everything he wants all the time, he will be disillusioned and conditioned for entitlement mind-sets. We gotta save him from himself and not ban him.

Mike
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-07-11 7:05 PM (#232081 - in reply to #232063)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
Oh, the bane of banning !

The Dear One pursuaded me to back off my side job today and apply for a security position with Bureau of Reclamation.
This will be the third one in the works. I swear, by the time you ever hear back, you've forgotten what they are calling about !

But as it relates to sucking vs. not sucking, with this little side job done, I should be able to buy all the materials to frame the
roof and weather the shop in. I will still have a few months of good weather to maybe get the floors poured ????
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-12-12 9:16 AM (#252969 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: RE: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
I guess we're back at being boring. I hope everyone else has as good of an excuse as I do.
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61plymy
Posted 2010-12-12 6:06 PM (#253033 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
Yeah, I do Doc. I suck.
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Jessica
Posted 2010-12-12 11:24 PM (#253055 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Elite Veteran

Posts: 1053
10002525
Location: Ny
Nothing happens in my region either, so don't feel bad. I'm moving in with the Colorado guys.... And if that doesn't work out, then I guess I'm moving to Scandinavia. LOL....

Edited by Jessica 2010-12-12 11:27 PM
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-12-14 9:05 AM (#253204 - in reply to #253055)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
OK, .... since no one else is offering up some FL holiday action, here's what I AM doing ....

12,000 miles from home, I am paying off my house, and socking enough dough away to finish the shop,
and should have a bunch left over for toys like a lift and a plasma cutter. I'll update the shop thread
when it happens. But for now, just doing my job and banking the dough.

You guys mean to tell me that the entire collective PNW region has NOTHING to report back but the
sound of crickets ? It is winter ! No one has locked themselves in the garage and got some work done ?

That is pathetic !
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ttotired
Posted 2010-12-14 10:04 AM (#253212 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Expert 5K+

Posts: 8443
50002000100010010010010025
Location: Perth Australia
well funny about your region doc, the only action in my region seems to be your impending visit lol

I wonder if you will get the same publicity/welcome ect that Opra got lmao

shame your not comming over here to the west

Mick
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55poly
Posted 2010-12-14 10:39 AM (#253216 - in reply to #253204)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



FwdLk56's Third Account

Posts: 738
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Location: Midwest USA


Doctor DeSoto - 2010-12-14 9:05 AM
It is winter ! No one has locked themselves in the garage and got some work done ?

That is pathetic ! :bleh:



does installing an OSB ceiling and dropping in two layers of R19 count?
(even if i'm not from the Pac NW...)
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-12-14 1:59 PM (#253252 - in reply to #253212)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
ttotired - 2010-12-15 7:04 AM

well funny about your region doc, the only action in my region seems to be your impending visit lol

I wonder if you will get the same publicity/welcome ect that Opra got lmao

shame your not comming over here to the west

Mick


*******************************

You'd think by this forum their were more FL cars than Kangaroos down there.

Funny, but I am often mistaken for Oprah.
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-12-14 2:00 PM (#253253 - in reply to #253216)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
55poly - 2010-12-15 7:39 AM
does installing an OSB ceiling and dropping in two layers of R19 count?
(even if i'm not from the Pac NW...)


**********************************

Did you route the fuel lines correctly, and what about the overspray ?
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floyd066
Posted 2010-12-15 10:26 AM (#253359 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Extreme Veteran

Posts: 347
10010010025
Location: Ocean Park, Washington
OK, my powerflite has just been rebuilt as of yesterday. I will get that back this weekend with a engine hoist so the 331 poly and transmission can go back into the chassis. My goal is this before Jan. 1. How's that?
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61plymy
Posted 2010-12-15 12:13 PM (#253376 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
Did some say something in here?? Hello??



I thought I heard something.


Jessica, if them Colorado boys don't treat you right, you just come on up to Wa. and we'll take care of you. Course, you need a building with dehumidifier and heat to put your car in, secure doors, a couple of guns, and your old cars will have to meet current day Ca. emissions standards (because we are home to all the Californians that f**ked up California and they are hard at work f**king up Washington now).

But it's a really nice place!

Bonus is, we don't talk much, but that's OK 'cause we don't listen much either, so it's all good there. We are also a frequent host to anarchists out of Oregon, whom you may have seen in action in the Battle of Seattle a few years ago.

Also, if you are of the Liberal persuasion, your vote will always count, sometimes many, many times in any individual election. If you are more Conservative or Libertarian, your vote gets flushed down the sewey hole. It's OK though, cause the sewer treatment plant has a sludge program here, so your vote gets to fertilize the vegetable gardens that feed all the Vegan, Liberal, Tree Hugging, Animal Rights, Anti-hunting, Anti-gun neighbors.

So don't be a stranger if Colorado doesn't work out, Jess.

Mike
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-12-15 1:29 PM (#253382 - in reply to #253359)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
floyd066 - 2010-12-16 7:26 AM

OK, my powerflite has just been rebuilt as of yesterday. I will get that back this weekend with a engine hoist so the 331 poly and transmission can go back into the chassis. My goal is this before Jan. 1. How's that?


*****************************************

Outstanding ! Some REAL Forward Look action!

Pix ?
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2010-12-15 1:34 PM (#253383 - in reply to #253376)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



5000500050005000200050025
Location: Parts Unknown
61plymy - 2010-12-16 9:13 AM

Also, if you are of the Liberal persuasion, your vote will always count, sometimes many, many times in any individual election. If you are more Conservative or Libertarian, your vote gets flushed down the sewey hole. It's OK though, cause the sewer treatment plant has a sludge program here, so your vote gets to fertilize the vegetable gardens that feed all the Vegan, Liberal, Tree Hugging, Animal Rights, Anti-hunting, Anti-gun neighbors.

So don't be a stranger if Colorado doesn't work out, Jess.

Mike


****************************************************

Mike,

Is there any particular reason you still live on the wet side ?

Is it the over-inflated property values ? The 300 days of rain and/or grey per year ? Is it the staggering
traffic and 'burban sprawl ?

Or is it just the reasons you listed above ?

My side of the state is dry and reasonable. Escape while you still can.
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61plymy
Posted 2010-12-15 6:51 PM (#253413 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!


Expert

Posts: 2824
2000500100100100
Location: Snohomish, WA.
Doc, I'd a been gone long ago, but my business keeps me here. Been running it since 1987 and it's too old to move willy-nilly.

However, if the State ever divided at the Cascade ridge line, I'd then be forced to pick up lock stock and barrel and head your way. Without the East side to mitigate the bulls**t, I'd be taxed and bullied out of business.

Mike
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big m
Posted 2010-12-15 8:35 PM (#253430 - in reply to #222095)
Subject: Re: I want a new region that actually doesn't suck!



Expert 5K+

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Location: Williams California
Not much going on around here show or swap meet-wise lately. Been picking up a boatload of cars lately, and got the yard overflowing again.

Picked up this non-FL car this last week, getting it running and drivable now.

---John



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