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1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)
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56D500boy
Posted 2020-07-24 10:01 PM (#601271)
Subject: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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In my on-going search for info about the late(r) 1956 Model year installation of Torqueflites in Imperials (for sure), Chryslers (some) and Desotos (at least one), I am looking for any evidence that some late run 1956 Dodges got Torqueflites in the factory. We know about Per E's 56 Dodge CRL convertible and his Torqueflite, but I am wondering whether there were more. If there were more, there would likely be a service manual. I found and bought a 92 page 56 Imperial and Chrysler Torqueflite Service Manual s few weeks back and today I found that there was the equivalent service manual for the 56 Desotos. This got me wondering (again) about the 56 Dodges and Torqueflites.

Any info leading the arrest (er...) purchase of a 56 Dodge Torqueflite Service manual or an post-factory Torqueflite installation guide for 1956 Dodges (and/or Plymouths or Desotos) would be greatly appreciated.

This is what I have/know about so far:



Edited by 56D500boy 2020-07-24 11:06 PM




(56ChryslerTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Cover.jpg)



(56ChryslerTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Index.jpg)



(56ChryslerTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_BackCover.jpg)



(56DesotoTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Cover.jpg)



(56DesotoTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Index.jpg)



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Attachments 56ChryslerTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Cover.jpg (198KB - 195 downloads)
Attachments 56ChryslerTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Index.jpg (245KB - 193 downloads)
Attachments 56ChryslerTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_BackCover.jpg (229KB - 193 downloads)
Attachments 56DesotoTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Cover.jpg (57KB - 193 downloads)
Attachments 56DesotoTorquefliteFactoryServiceManual_Index.jpg (133KB - 191 downloads)
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chryslerman101
Posted 2020-07-25 10:27 AM (#601284 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: RE: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)


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Interesting information given. I also found a Hemmings magazine comprehensive article that describes the Torqueflite transmission that was available for Chrysler Corporation's late production car models, including for the late production 1956 Dodge models.

https://www.hemmings.com/stories/article/torque-to-me

Also, I have a large collection of old newspapers and I was looking thru some of the issues, when I found an old 1957 newspaper that contained a car dealership ad that was selling a 1956 Dodge Custom Royal Lancer with a Torqueflite transmission.

 





(1956 dodge torqueflight =The_Cincinnati_Enquirer_Fri__Oct_11__1957_.jpg)



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Attachments 1956 dodge torqueflight =The_Cincinnati_Enquirer_Fri__Oct_11__1957_.jpg (214KB - 188 downloads)
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56D500boy
Posted 2020-07-25 12:12 PM (#601289 - in reply to #601284)
Subject: RE: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Thanks for the input. Sadly, I don't believe Hemmings articles as being 100% accurate anymore. An article written by a nameless "contributor" who can't be taken to task/quizzed doesn't help with that.

As for the used car advert, it might be true but it also might just be a salesmen's trick (or ignorance) to get the punters in to the lot to have a look. I have seen used car adverts for 56 Plymouths with Torqueflites and I don't believe them (either).

I need/want some kind of official Chrysler/Dodge Division document that verifies that Torqueflites were in more than one 1956 Dodge.

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56D500boy
Posted 2023-06-16 6:46 PM (#630262 - in reply to #601289)
Subject: RE: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Not to long ago, while looking for the Rainbow Unicorn represented by a 56 Dodge TorqueFlite Manual, I found a 56 Desoto TorqueFlite manual on eBay for a decent price. So I bought it.

Just picked it up today.

There is a document number D-15747 and it is dated "3-56" which seems reasonable (same as the 56 Chrysler/Imperial Torqueflite Manual which is numbered D-15748)

Page 4 shows a shifter cover plate. Looks very much a Chrysler plate.

Now to find the equivalent 56 Dodge TorqueFlite manual.



Edited by 56D500boy 2023-06-16 7:33 PM




(56DesotoTorquefliteManual_Cover_small.jpg)



(56DesotoTorquefliteManual_ForwardPageDated_3-56_small.jpg)



(PageWithTorquefliiteShifterPlate_small.jpg)



(56DesotoTorquefliteManual_BackCover_small.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments 56DesotoTorquefliteManual_Cover_small.jpg (147KB - 54 downloads)
Attachments 56DesotoTorquefliteManual_ForwardPageDated_3-56_small.jpg (149KB - 51 downloads)
Attachments PageWithTorquefliiteShifterPlate_small.jpg (149KB - 55 downloads)
Attachments 56DesotoTorquefliteManual_BackCover_small.jpg (148KB - 54 downloads)
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-06-18 7:55 PM (#630296 - in reply to #630262)
Subject: RE: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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I just sent this to Danielle S. at Stellantis Historical and Mark B. the Detroit Public Library Research:

"In investigating the TorqueFlite transmission situation in 1956, I became aware that some 56 Desotos got the 3 speed TorqueFlites as well, from the factory. To that end, I recently bought an original (used) 56 Desoto TorqueFlite Service Manual (document D-15747) just to have and compare to the Chrysler document (very very close).

Recently, in the June 2023 issue of the magazine "Collectible Automobile, in an article written by a Robert Gabrick, he mentioned that there were nine (9) 1956 Desotos that received TorqueFlite transmissions. He also stated that 118 1956 Dodges got Torqueflites. (See attached scan of the page from that article with his numbers).

So if a mere 9 Desotos got the new TorqueFlite transmission and Chrysler Corp. felt obligated to create a Desoto-specific service manual, I am thinking that 118 Dodges definitely must have warranted a TorqueFlite Servce manual. HOWEVER, despite having searched the internet for this missing document, I have had no luck. Not even a sniff of the what I seek.

Hence this email I am hoping that one or both of you might have a lead on a 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Service Manual that I could follow. I would guess that the document would have a number like D-15746 or D-15749 but that is just a wild guess. The cover would probably have a lot of red and black.

Thanks in Advance"

Fingers crossed.

By the way, I contacted Robert Gabrick at the end of may hoping for reference for his "118 Dodge Torqueflite" numbers source. Not reply yet. None.



Edited by 56D500boy 2023-06-18 7:56 PM




(CollectibleAutomobileJune2023Page45.jpg)



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56D500boy
Posted 2023-06-27 3:52 PM (#630447 - in reply to #630296)
Subject: RE: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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56D500boy - 2023-06-18 4:55 PM
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I just sent this to Danielle S. at Stellantis Historical and Mark B. the Detroit Public Library Research:

"Thanks in Advance"

By the way, I contacted Robert Gabrick at the end of May hoping for reference for his "118 Dodge Torqueflite" numbers source. Not reply yet. None.



Heard back from both Danielle at Stellantis Historical and Mark B. at the Detroit Public library. Neither of them had anything like I am looking for in their holdings.

I also finally did hear back from Robert Gabrick and he said:

"The details about the Dodges and DeSotos with the TorqueFlite transmissions come from the late Jeffery Godshall in his feature article about the 1955-56 Imperial that ran in the December 2013 issue of Collectible Automobile. The section about the TorqueFlite is on page 55."

I don't have that magazine. If there is someone here with it could you scan page 55 in that article and send it to me (full sized scan). I will post a screen friendly version of the scan here.

I might have to arrange a seance to ask Jeffery about his sources.

Bottomline: Looking for a scan of page 55 of the December 2013 issue of Collectible Automobile



Edited by 56D500boy 2023-06-27 4:11 PM
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60 dart
Posted 2023-06-27 5:33 PM (#630448 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Powerflite
Posted 2023-06-27 6:38 PM (#630449 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Here is one.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/314601013904

But for this magazine to be meaningful, he would need to list his sources... which is doubtful that he does here.

Edited by Powerflite 2023-06-27 6:40 PM
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-06-27 6:40 PM (#630450 - in reply to #630448)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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60 dart - 2023-06-27 2:33 PM
you can buy a back issue! -------------------------------------later


Sure. But I only need/want one page (55)

US$12.95 each plus US$4.95 postage (U.S. only) - which means a 40 mile (round-trip) drive, a border crossing (always fun) and a US$4 fee at my US mail drop.

Seems a lot for one page.

https://collectibleautomobile.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/1218CA-...

Maybe some Imperial owner will take pity on me



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56D500boy
Posted 2023-06-27 7:03 PM (#630452 - in reply to #630449)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Powerflite - 2023-06-27 3:38 PM
But for this magazine to be meaningful, he would need to list his sources... which is doubtful that he does here.


Agree. The author, Jeffery Godshall, was (apparently) a Chrysler designer and historian so he might have access to some good info. However, he has is apparently gone to meet his maker. So it will be difficult to quiz him on his exact sources.

Seance anyone?

"We are saddened to learn that the highly respected automotive designer, author, and historian Jeffrey I. Godshall has passed away. “Jeff” died on December 15, following an extended period of ill health. He was a retired Senior Design Manager, formerly with Chrysler’s Product Design Office, for 45 years (1963-2007). There, he worked on a variety of exterior and interior design projects spanning from sixties Dodge Muscle Cars to the Chrysler PT Cruiser.

One of the first 100 members of the Society of Automotive Historians, Jeff authored many wonderful articles on automotive history topics—among them a number written from his personal perspective as a professional automotive designer. He also served as Chief Judge for the annual EyesOn Design Automotive Design Exhibition, from the early 1990s into the mid-2000s.

Jeff was a major collector of automotive literature and it was through our mutual interest in such materials that we first corresponded with him in the early 1970s. We chatted with him a few times at Hershey SAH meetings in that period. But it wasn’t until we moved to Detroit in 1986 that we really got to know Jeff. He had a tremendous sense of humor and was, of course, a “walking encyclopedia” of automotive history. It was always a delight to be around him. R.I.P., Jeff Godshall."

REFERENCE: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1523156571311851/posts/2176236142670...




Edited by 56D500boy 2023-06-27 10:14 PM
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Powerflite
Posted 2023-06-27 8:43 PM (#630455 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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At least he sounds a lot more credible than the typical car guy. I'm more interested to see what he had to say in the article now. Not sure I want to spend $18 to find out though.
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-06-28 5:00 PM (#630481 - in reply to #630455)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Passed on this eBay "auction" (BIN) for US$19.95 plus $5.95 shipping

https://www.ebay.com/itm/256091968155

And when to the source:

https://collectibleautomobile.com/order-back-issues/

Phoned 1-800-871-2022 and talked to "Sue"

US$12.95 for the back issue and US$4.95 for the shipping (to a US address - apparently they will ship to Canada but the shipping cost is insane)

I found a Dec. 1991 issue with an article about 55-56 Plymouths by Jeffery Godshall and would have added that to my order but they are out of that one.

https://collectibleautomobile.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/CA_INDE...

Just checked eBay and there was a lot of 4 Collectible Automobile mags from 1991-2 including the Dec. 1991 issue. Bought the lot on a BIN.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/165317319005

I will post the 55-56 Plymouth info to the forum when I get them.



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Powerflite
Posted 2023-06-28 8:37 PM (#630490 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Cool, you'll also get a '55-'56 Dodge article from August '91. Let us know what you find out from them.
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-07-03 4:24 PM (#630594 - in reply to #630481)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Just got a call from "Sue" at Collectible Automobile to tell me that "because of the July 4th holiday, they won't be shipping this week. The next shipment day will be July 14th".

Oh boy. Thanks.

In the meantime, the fellow with the same magazine on eBay came to me with an offer that was less than his previous amount (and it would be faster than Collectible Automobile) but I told him that I had just purchased the magazine from Collectible Automobile (thinking that they would be shipping this week).

Now I might have to cancel in Collectible Automobile and go back to the eBay seller.

For the love of (insert your preferred diety here), I *JUST* want to see page 55 in that issue.

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56D500boy
Posted 2023-07-03 7:20 PM (#630596 - in reply to #630594)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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56D500boy - 2023-07-03 1:24 PM
Now I might have to cancel in Collectible Automobile and go back to the eBay seller.
For the love of (insert your preferred diety here), I *JUST* want to see page 55 in that issue.


Cancelled my Collectible Automobile back order (they don't put the order through VISA until they ship).

Went back to the eBay seller and offered a bit less than he was asking and got it.

Now I should get it by the end of the week or next Monday.

Crazy. I only really need one page. That is one expensive page now.

(I will scan and post it here when I get it).

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56D500boy
Posted 2023-07-11 5:39 PM (#630706 - in reply to #630596)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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56D500boy - 2023-07-03 4:20 PM
Went back to the eBay seller and offered a bit less than he was asking and got it.
Now I should get it by the end of the week or next Monday.
Crazy. I only really need one page. That is one expensive page now.
(I will scan and post it here when I get it).


Magazine came in (to Point Roberts WA) on Saturday. I picked it up today.

VERY disappointed. In a very nice article about the history of the 1955 and 1956 Imperials written by Jeffrey Godshall, he throws in a paragraph about the Torqueflites. (See scan below)

The "118" Torqueflites in 56 Dodges is there but there is absolutely no references for his statement. And he is dead. I nobody seems to know where his reference library went.

Bummed out, man.

Is there a book on the history of the Chrysler Torqueflite transmission (starting with the cast-iron A-466)??



Edited by 56D500boy 2023-07-11 11:25 PM




(CollectibleAutomobileDec2013_ExcerptPg55_Re_Torqueflites_small_Annotated.jpg)



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Attachments CollectibleAutomobileDec2013_ExcerptPg55_Re_Torqueflites_small_Annotated.jpg (148KB - 50 downloads)
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Powerflite
Posted 2023-07-11 8:43 PM (#630712 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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That's pretty cool though. It's the first time I have seen the 5425 number, the fact that they were installed in New Yorkers as well, and the 9 DeSoto & 118 Dodge numbers. That's a lot less DeSoto's than I expected, and a lot more Dodge's than I expected. Notice that there is no mention of Plymouth in those numbers, as I expected. Getting ahold of that reference material would be cool. But until then, I'm inclined to take this information at his word.

Can you share the whole article? I'm very interested to read what he has to say.
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geoffs60
Posted 2023-07-11 9:38 PM (#630713 - in reply to #630712)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)


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The only way that could verify it would be a codeing on the data plate that signifies the TF as the fitted transmission, my understanding is that the data plate doesnt
drill down this far on info ? how ever I am no expert when it comes to data plates.
Like yourself I have a factory 1956 Desoto TF w/shop manual, but to date havnt seen any listing in the parts book referencing the face plate or associated parts for desoto/dodge, other than the Chrysler models.
Geoff
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-07-12 2:50 AM (#630715 - in reply to #630713)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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geoffs60 - 2023-07-11 6:38 PM
Like yourself I have a factory 1956 Desoto TF w/shop manual, but to date haven't seen any listing in the parts book referencing the face plate or associated parts for desoto/dodge, other than the Chrysler models.
Geoff


The American Mopar parts book did not show the 5 button shifter plate for the 1956 Dodges with Torqueflites, i.e. 1705 370, but the 1956 Canadian Chryco parts book does. It also shows five button shifter housings for the 56 Desotos (1685 198) and the Chryslers and Imperials (1685 735) (See below)

I guess one difference is the Dodge used a shifter button plate whereas the Desotos and Chryslers used a complete housing.



(56MoparPushButtonTransShifterPlate_small_Annotated.jpg)



(1705370_56DodgeTFShifterPlate_back.jpg)



(1705370_56DodgeTFShifterPlate_front.jpg)



(56ImperialShifterPlateAndButtons.jpg)



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Attachments 56MoparPushButtonTransShifterPlate_small_Annotated.jpg (149KB - 45 downloads)
Attachments 1705370_56DodgeTFShifterPlate_back.jpg (84KB - 49 downloads)
Attachments 1705370_56DodgeTFShifterPlate_front.jpg (82KB - 46 downloads)
Attachments 56ImperialShifterPlateAndButtons.jpg (193KB - 46 downloads)
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Powerflite
Posted 2023-07-12 10:33 AM (#630721 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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The Dodge used a different housing as well. Swed57's original '56 Dodge with torqueflite showed a different casting for it, but it used the same part number as the 2 speed housing. Remember this thread?

http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=67640
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-07-12 10:49 AM (#630723 - in reply to #630721)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Powerflite - 2023-07-12 7:33 AM
The Dodge used a different housing as well. Swed57's original '56 Dodge with torqueflite showed a different casting for it, but it used the same part number as the 2 speed housing. Remember this thread?


That 2 lug housing that Per E. (Swede57) found when trying to figure out the providence of his car's Torqueflite transmission is, to me, a red herring (in his case, a pickled red herring, I guess).

My 56 Dodge came with a Powerflite automatic and its housing was two lug and every other 56 Dodge shifter housing that I have ever bumped into has been a two lug so that, again, to me, means nothing in terms of Torqueflite.

(BTW, *IF* Per E's Torqueflite was really installed at the factory, that is the only one that I have heard of. One of 118? I am 99.995% skeptical about the 118 part)

The bigger question is why was there ever a 4 lug 56 Dodge housing? The plate over the buttons only has two screws.

Mine:





Some random one off eBay:



Mine now (after an H*** of a lot of work to remove it):



REF: http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=70969&...





Edited by 56D500boy 2023-07-12 10:51 AM
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Powerflite
Posted 2023-07-12 6:11 PM (#630727 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Good point. I don't have common '56 Dodge shifter housings to look at. As I mentioned before, I would expect it to be 118 DeSotos and 9 Dodges. Maybe it was a typo?
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-07-12 6:23 PM (#630729 - in reply to #630727)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Powerflite - 2023-07-12 3:11 PM
Good point. I don't have common '56 Dodge shifter housings to look at.
As I mentioned before, I would expect it to be 118 DeSotos and 9 Dodges. Maybe it was a typo?


As shown in my shifter housing removal nightmare thread, I am, unfortunately, intimately familiar with the nature of the 56 Dodge housing.

As for 118 vs 9, I would tend to agree that that is a more likely scenario. 118 Desotos and 9 Dodges.

For 118 Desotos, I can see them (management) thinking, "We need a Desoto Torqueflite manual".

For 9 Dodges, I can see them thinking, "Nah, they (the mechanics) can use either the Chrysler or Desoto Torqueflite manuals (since they both cover what was needed anyway)" and therefore
no Dodge Torqueflite manuals were ever produced.

I only have one more possibility of finding Jeffrey Godshall's reference materials, a contact at the AACA, that I am hoping to get from Gerard W.



Edited by 56D500boy 2023-07-12 6:30 PM
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geoffs60
Posted 2023-07-12 6:41 PM (#630730 - in reply to #630729)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)


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Thanks for the p/number for the desoto hsg, interesting where p/numbers end up from Canada/USA parts books.
Geoff
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PolyJ
Posted 2023-08-05 12:44 AM (#631171 - in reply to #601271)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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I think Occam's razor applies here in that some team or persons in upper management or with its ear decided rather late in the game that they would install the A466 in 1956 DeSotos and printed Dave's March 1956 DeSoto service manual and publicized the A466 internally to some dealerships. Then something stopped that plan from materializing so late in 1956 that 1957 models were already either under production or plants were retooling for production that fitting 1956 models was pointless and would cost too much to be worthwhile. For a hot rodder or customizer with the tools, parts, and knowledge, it's a weekend swap (at last that's the time I spent converting my 1956 Dodge to a cable-operated A727); for a production line, it means throwing a wrench into the works and slowing production potentially by dozens if not hundreds. The most straightforward theory is that we end up with a 1956 service manual that doesn't reflect 1956 production due to a change in plans, which is much more plausible than the alternative theories.

In order for the A466 to be considered an DeSoto and Dodge option 1956, the DeSoto assembly line would have had to retool the well-establish production line that had been used all of 1956 to install the A466 in a supposed but so far unsubstantiated 9 or 118 vehicles just before they retooled for the 1957 run, despite Dave's efforts and money spent sleuthing out evidence. It's even more of a stretch to think the Dodge assembly line would deviate late in production to install the A466 in 9 vehicles just before they retooled for 1957. Of course, a very few 1956 DeSotos and possibly Dodges could have been pulled off the line to have a small group of people custom fit them with the A466 and then put them back on the line for the remaining assembly for very unique purposes (racing, auto shows, company/dealership management or family members, expensive custom orders, etc.), but its more likely no such vehicles existed and that any surviving suggestions (from what I'm reading here and elsewhere on the forum we're talking about around two known) were modified by a mechanic somewhere between 1956 and 2023 with an eye for details to where the retrofit passes for factory. It's still an interesting historical thesis and research project, and I've enjoyed reading through the thread.

Dave, if you ever end up scanning the service manual into a PDF, I'd love to read it.
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56D500boy
Posted 2023-08-05 11:49 AM (#631181 - in reply to #631171)
Subject: Re: 1956 Dodge Torqueflite Factory Service Manual. (NO I don't mean Powerflite)



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Location: Lower Mainland BC
.
Interesting thoughts Justin. Seems plausible.

I hate the fact that there is nobody alive (that we know of) who was "on the line" in 1956 to confirm or deny your thoughts. OR if they were alive they would be very old and possibly gaga memory-wise.

As for scanning either the 56 Chrysler or Desoto Torqueflite service manuals, that ain't gonna happen (too much work for really no need/demand). Actual hardcopies are still out there for purchase, e.g. eBay:

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l131...

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