IML: DISK BRAKE CONVERSION

[StadtApoAchern@xxxxxxxxxxx (dietmar frensemeyer)]

Third try to get this message to the IML - it is frustrating ....
Here is my comment:
1.) as a longtime IML member I often said: my  IMP drum brakes work fine.
2.) The values that Eric found - GREAT JOB - are reasonable because
a. the  friction surface of the drum brakes are bigger than the friction
surface of the rotors
b. the cars were tested only once and only from 60 to zero instead 120 mph
to zero.
3.) The weight of the tested cars  is not mentioned.
4.) In general: braking means converting kinetic energy into heat. To brake
a car you need two friction surfaces and a system  to press them together.
The formula for kinetic energy is m/2 x v²  meaning that speed goes in  by
square !! If You use rotors you have the pads, the friction ring of the
rotor, and mostly a floating calliper system with one piston. You will
realize at once, that the pad surface of the disk brake is much smaller than
the friction surface of the drum. So what is better? The cooling  of the
rotor is way better ... meaning how quick the heat is dissipated. And the
rotor / calliper combo is much cheaper to produce and to install. The
service to me  needs the same care - even e floating calliper has to be
serviced or it will not float.
5.) More improvement is given by a fixed calliper system. You will have at
least one piston  up to four on each side of the calliper. This system needs
a special front end construction, which has to be very stable. Fixed
calliper disk brakes  show better results but often less comfort. (noise,
warping)
6.) More improvement is given by bigger pistons in the callipers, more
hydraulic pressure, and more aggressive pads ..
7.) More improvement is given by larger and thicker rotors which need larger
wheels
8.) More improvement is given by airducts, which carry cold air to the disks
and carry away hot air from the disks.
9.) More improvement is given by special design of the rotors to guide the
cold air from the inner side through the rotor to the exterior ...
10.) Now how is the Imperial ?
a. My 1960 is heavy as a Hummer, has 15" wheels and drives  100 mph - I
would never go faster.  A Hummer has 20" to 28" wheels
b. The servo, the brake master cylinder  and the wheel brake cylinder
produce  a sufficient brake force
c. The friction surface is huge
d. The heat dissipating is bad.
e. The result is good for braking once from 60 mph but bad from 100 mph and
very bad for repeated  braking...
f. To get a better result with rotors you have to enlarge the friction
surface (larger wheels), the pressure (larger pistons  better servo), the
heat dissipating (HOW?)

   What is possible now for older IMP'S?
Movit, my son's  business   had developed special brakes for SECURITY CARS.
Those heavy weights, mostly MERCEDES G  - have 15"/16"  wheels.
Movit developed special  BILLET six piston callipers for those little !!
wheels, with a large pad area and thick 298 mm rotors which fit under the
15" wheels.
Probably I will convert my Imp  this Year with those brakes, but
You may imagine that those BILLET callipers are not "GIVEN" .. the official
price is 3400 EURO .. for the kit.

Pleas ask if You have any further  question ..
dietmar
www.movit.de/htm/imp60hom.htm











-----Original Message-----
From: mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Eric
Sent: Montag, 24. Januar 2005 07:34
To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: IML: Brake Testing Data

Henry Ford,
Well shucks, you didn't mention having the EFI parts already, go for it.
It's a frequent topic in here and we'd all be interested in seeing the
conversion. I gathered braking info from the road tests in the site. There
appears to be a 10-20% shorter stopping distances in disk brake Imperials
from the tests of a couple of different magazine brands. None of the
magazines we have listed braking distance testing prior to 1961, from what I
could find. The drum brake cars are grouped and averaged apart from disk
brake cars. All tests were from 60mph.

1961    158
1962    185
1963    192
1964    176
1965    184.6    Last of drum brake tests
Average 179.12 for front drum brake cars

1968    158       Budd disk
1969    116.7    In this test, all cars stopped shorter than avg
1971    164       With Sure Brake
1973    151.6
1974    167        4 wheel disk
1981    181
Average 156.383 for all front disk brake cars
Average 151.46 for all front disk brake full size cars
Average 160.15 for all front disk brake full size cars excluding 1969
abnormally short stopping distance.

Let us know how it goes.

Eric
Portland, Oregon
_______________________________________________________
I had bought a edelbrock fuelinjection system for a 76 cordoba with 440 in
it after I wrecked the car to avoide hitting a kid on a bike. I pulled all
parts off the car and now I have an option as to use it on the imperial.
when it was on the cordoba the car ran very smooth. starts on first try
never haveta pat the gass int the mornings. and the exhaust was cleaner less
carbon.   basicaly the engine ran like new.      no hesitation .or lugging
on mountain roads.  . after all . if chrysler had today's technoligy back in
the 50's you bet every imperial would be the first to have it as a standard
part on the car.. I wont be using any chrome on the engine at all. I can
hide most of the fuel system and ecm there's plenty of room to hide just
about anything under that big hood. the system I may use is about 2 yrs old
but has a few mods done to it to make it look factory in the cordoba........
and thanks for everyone input on this subject. but like most of you I probly
will use the factory carb. I have a kit to rebuild it on order, from
autozone.



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