Now, that people is what this club is for. At least for me, it is the history, times, passion of the industry that was incestuous like many others still are today (Legal community). Bringing in fresh blood as the need arises, but the influences are still old school as in any industry. The "Good Old Boys" network still rules, only not as clearly visible as in generations past. History, and parts. Parts is a big thing too. Oh, and good friends made. OK, there are a few things. Today, I think Chrysler is stronger than was anticipated by Daimler and the American populace does not take well to corporate takeovers when done in reverse. You can make a Volvo a Furd, a Saab a GM, or Mitsubishi a Chrysler, but you can't take a Chrysler and make it a Benz. The company balked, and I think the American car buyers balked. As Chrysler comes out with new innovative products, forward "Out of the Box" designs, rear drive, V-8 powered cars the U.S. goes nuts over the cars again. Benz killed Plymouth (BIG mistake IMHO) and in '99 killed the then in final design and testing, the "New Hemi", and rear drive platform. The 300 would have been out years earlier if let be, but Benz thought differently. Pity. The strongest sellers Ma Mopar has are the American inspired ones, not the hybrid Chrybenz cars Daimler has brought forward. The new introductions have all overestimated the "Upscale" market Daimler wants Chrysler to be. Not TOO upscale, but certainly not a company with a "Plymouth" in the family photo...or an Imperial...for now... Now, if only I could smack the A-hole about the head and neck with a stick, who thought putting the Charger badge on a 4-door Sedan, not even a hardtop, was a good idea...blasphemy! Thank you to Bill Watson for the history lesson. It helps to put things into perspective. Thanks to Mikey for being so eloquent yesterday :) Bill ("Too Fruity Blueberry" - Imperial Lager inductee, 2005 Rhody Days Festival - Hosted by Haze Green '67 Imperial Sedan owner and web designer Leslie) Wm. R. Ulman Seattle, WA '66 Crown Convertible Coupe - Doris Day '95 Buick Roadmaster - Rock Hudson twolaneblacktop@xxxxxxxxxxx -----Original Message----- From: mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Bill Watson Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 11:09 PM To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: IML: K.T Keller & Styling Kaufman Thelma (K.T.) Keller's 'boxcars' are so named as they were viewed as one rectangular box on top of two other rectangular boxes. The other manufacturers may have had similar designs at first glance, but Keller's boxcars were boxy. The Studebaker lines flowed from front to rear, with the lines swinging down toward the rear. From above you can see the lines flow from the front hood onto the trunk lid and curve inward at the rear edge. The GM models had flowing fender lines, each with different tail treatments, some models had fastback rooflines that curved from the rear door area down to the rear bumper, and others had fender lines below the beltline. And each of General Motors three bodies had different roof treatments. Chrysler had two bodies and many people today still believe the Plymouth used the same body as the Chrysler. Although the Fords were boxy, the Mercury and Lincoln had front fender lines that flowed through the body to the rear and the rear fenders curved down to the rear bumper. As well, Ford's fender line ran from the front headlights to the rear taillights. Not like the Chrysler front fenders that disappeared in the front doors and while the higher line along the hood ran back into the trunk. For Chrysler, from 1949 to 1952 their cars were boxy. No flowing fender lines, no character lines running from front to rear on either the sides or from a top view, and the Plymouth fastbacks dropped to the rear bumper like a 1948 Ford. All Chrysler lines looked the same from behind with only the tallights differing from Plymouth from Dodge from DeSoto from Chrysler from Chrysler Imperial. Front ends, too, all had the same square front fenders and hoods, and only the grilles differed from Plymouth from Dodge from DeSoto from Chrysler from Chrysler Imperial. (The 1951-52 Chrysler Imperial front end was as different from a Chrysler New Yorker as the DeSoto was from a Chrysler Saratoga.) And the Chrysler lines were two to three inches higher than their competitors. And K.T. Keller had a lot to do with the design of Chrysler's vehicles from the time he became president in 1935 until he retired from the presidency in 1950. Whenever mock-ups of new cars were displayed Keller would show up with a hat and two dairy containers in tow. As well, Keller was not a thin man, although not as hefty as George Mason at Nash. Keller would climb into the front seat of each car wearing his hat and jounce around. The stylists would be standing at the sides, watching Keller's hat. For if his hat hit the ceiling, the car's roof line would have to be raised. And he would do the same in the rear. Once that was done, he would open the trunk and put his dairy tanks in and close the lid. If the lid closed, the stylists breathed a sigh of relief. If not, work would begin to raise the trunk line. And now you know why Chrysler's trunks and rooflines were so high through 1954. The 1955 models were the first since the 1937 models not done under Keller. The 1955 models were done under Virgil Exner and for the first time Chrysler actually announced to the world who designed their cars. Although Exner did not do all the work on the 1955 lines. he did take all the credit. Just like Raymond Loewy did for the 1947 Studebaker, the bulk of which was done by Exner. The back seat room in the 1967-68 Imperials, indeed all 1965-68 Chrysler Corporation C bodies, is due to Elwood Engel, not Keller. Keller carried on as Chairman of the Board from 1950 to 1960, but if you sat in the front or back seat of a 1957 Imperial wearing a hat or tried to put a dairy container in the trunk you would know Keller no longer had any influence on Chrysler styling, Engel's 1965-68 C bodies had square, formal lines (Engel's Angles) that provide ample interior room. Raymond Dietrich was Chrysler's first head of styling from 1932 through 1938. Chrysler's head of styliing worked under chief body engineer, Oliver Clark, through to the 1950's. (Oliver's son Dean was a stylist - most noted for the 1939 Club Coupe built by Hayes) Dietrich's last work would have been on the 1941 models, given the lead times needed. The 1941 through 1946 models were all done under Dietrch's successor, Bob Cadwallader, head of styling from 1938 to 1945. Two other Chrysler designers of that era were Herb Weissdinger and Arnott "Buzz" Grisinger. All three had left Chrysler by 1947 and, with the encouragement of Joseph W. Frazer, joined Kaiser-Frazer, with Cadwallader as head of styling. The trio's first task was the 1949 Kaiser-Frazer facelift, with grilles that are very similar to work they did at Chrysler. The 1946-48 models were a continuation of the themes set up by Dietrich and Cadwallader. And Cadwallader's successor, Henry King, gave Keller the boxcars he wanted. Keller did not like flowing fenders and streamlining in particular. And he said as much in a speech at the Stanford University School of Business in 1948. Chrysler stylists came up with designs in 1945-46 that would have given General Motors and Harley Earl a run for their money with flow-through fender lines, curved windshields and side sculpturing. But Keller said no. And that was that. Keller's boxcars appeared for 1949 and his losing fight against styling trends began. Virgil Exner was hired by Keller in 1949 to head Chrysler's Advance Styling Studio. When Keller retired in 1950, his sucessor, Lester Lum 'Tex' Colbert (pronounced "Kull-burt"), decided some major changes had to be done. He planned for an ambitious plant expansion, harder sales campaigns, "new blood" throughout the corporation and a total redesign of the company's cars as soon as possible. Although the last project would have to wait until 1955 to bring to fruition, Colbert did expand the company's production capacity when Chrysler acquired Briggs in late 1952. Chrysler's slide to #2 behind Ford by 1952 forced Colbert's hand and he named Exner director of Chrysler Styling in 1953. The collapse of Chrysler sales in 1954 proved once and for all that Keller's fight against 'streamlining' was a losing and costly battle. People would buy boxcars when demand was greater than supply, but when car companies had lots of cars to choose from, the boxcars were shunned. Exner was given a free hand with styling under Colbert, and for 1957 Exner did what Keller killed ten years earlier - put Harley Earl and styling at General Motors to shame. For his inspiring work, Colbert made Exner Chrysler's first Vice-President of Design, with over 300 persons under him. Over ten times the staff Dietrich had twenty years before. K.T. Keller died in January, 1966. Bill Vancouver, BC ----------------- http://www.imperialclub.com ----------------- This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please reply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be shared with everyone. Private messages (and attachments) for the Administrators should be sent to webmaster@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To UN-SUBSCRIBE, go to http://imperialclub.com/unsubscribe.htm