Re: IML: eBay

My experiences with this have been excellent as well. I don't bid on anything unless I am certain as I can be that it is exactly what I think it is, or I am willing to take the chance that it isn't. If I feel that there aren't enough pictures, I ask for more. If they don't come, I stop thinking about it and don't bid. This opportunity has allowed me to collect EVERY single part I needed to restore one of my cars without ever leaving to house to find it. That is in contrast to the old days of scouring swap meets with tables covered with junk to find one over priced part. I was fairly successful in negotiating pricies with sellers in person, but eBay has eliminated the need to deal with it. Something that took ten years to find before, now takes about a week. I have never been cheated, although some people have been. If a seller is a cheat, they won't last long on eBay. I haven't bought any cars there, but there have been several that I would have considered if I had been in the market. I think it is important to b e a smart shopper, and also have a very high level of familiarity with what you are looking at so you can spot things that don't look right.

Paul W.

-----Original Message-----
From: Dick Benjamin <dickb@xxxxxxxxx>
To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wed, 5 Apr 2006 21:33:14 -0700
Subject: IML: eBay

There have been a couple of derogatory remarks today regarding car buying on
eBay, and while I have sounded off before on the subject, I think it's time
to speak up again.

I have both bought and sold on eBay almost since they started business, and
my experience has been overwhelmingly positive, for about 350 transaction so
far, just about half selling, half buying, and almost all car related,
either parts, literature, tools, or cars themselves.

My experience is that the private individuals using eBay are about 99.5%
honest, straightforward people who will not cheat you, and will accurately
describe items they have for sale.  

Of course there are some people who are out to fool you; to sell you
something that isn't what is represented, but in my opinion they are pretty
easy to spot.  They usually have very flashy, professionally done auction
pages, with beautiful artwork, a lot of canned "boilerplate" stuff regarding
shipping, warranties, etc - all very professional.  Their car descriptions
use words that would never pass the lips of a serious old car collector -
words such as "Perfect", "100% Original", "Showroom new", "#1 condition",
"appraised for twice the reserve", "Rare"(when it isn't) etc.  You can be
sure their descriptions are exaggerated and full of hype. Certainly their
pages are beautiful, with lots of pretty pictures etc.  

Parts dealers are usually very easily spotted also, as they usually use the
"buy it now" or "eBay store" features of the site, and they have done
thousands of transactions.  I know some amateurs do that too, but generally,
the dealers are doing a higher volume business and find it easier to use the
professional web page and auction page builders.  

When I have sold cars on eBay, (and I have sold 13 of my collection in the
last few years as I plod through my final active years), I go out of my way
to post an auction page that lists in voluminous detail everything I can
think of about the car including every single defect, no matter how small.
Many on the IML have seen my auctions, and know I speak the truth here.  I
also give a detailed history of the car, including how long I have owned it
(usually many years). I show pictures of EVERYTHING!  By that I mean the
chassis from underneath, seats, carpets, engine compartment, dash, trunk and
on and on.  Usually I show just the important stuff on the main auction
page, but I include a link to another page that has 30 or 40 more pictures,
and much more in the way of narrative discussion of what I have done to the
car, what it needs, and again, excruciating detail of every single defect.


I always start a car auction at $100, and I never put a reserve on the car.
I've been called an idiot, and worse, for this practice, but in my opinion,
that method guarantees that the car will sell for fair market value, not
someone's hoped for windfall amount.  For example, some of you were shocked
when I listed my 67 Convertible in 2004 for $100 starting bid and with no
reserve. It finished up at about $15,000, which was, in my opinion a very
fair price for an unrestored but very nice 84,000 mile Southern California
"black plate" car. The car went to a true collector, who is delighted, using
it as a daily driver, and showing it in some of our local shows.  

In sum, I think anyone who is moderately cautious, and deals only with
private parties with clean feedback ratings and a track record of at least a
few good transactions can expect to be treated fairly.

I think someone who buys a car from a dealer without adequate detail in the
auction page and/or inspection in person or by a trusted and qualified
friend is taking a large chance.  But even then, if the feedback rating is
perfect, and the seller's number of transactions is high enough to inspire
confidence, your chances are probably better than buying a car from used car
lot or from a private party whose car is parked on a street corner with a
sign on it.  

An eBay seller has a reputation to protect that is very valuable to him, and
that is a potent deterrent to shady dealing.  Everything is up front and
visible about an eBay seller, but you must pay attention to it. 

Regarding "professional" appraiser and inspection services, I personally
don't recommend using them - I think most look up the car in the latest
value guide, do a cursory inspection, and have no more technical ability to
evaluate a car's true condition than your brother-in-law. "Appraisals" done
for "stated value insurance" purposes often simply state what the owner
wants to hear.

If you are interested in a car that is a long way from you and you don't
have time to do it yourself, ask here on the IML for a nearby volunteer to
go look at a car for you - and of course, offer to pay any expenses
involved.  Ask to have a good set of pictures taken, including ones taken
from below (up on a lift), and ask for a test drive, long enough to get up
to full operating temperature, and up to freeway speeds, if only briefly.
Paying a local mechanic for a looking over is also a good idea, but he has
to be someone known to be honest and thorough.

OK, I'm done here. If anyone wants to argue with me, I can be reached at:
dickb@xxxxxxxxx

Dick Benjamin



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