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------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are 15 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: Upgrades to historic cars
From: MJMLandDev@xxxxxxx
2. Re: new 300 toy
From: "Terry & Andree Hoeman" <tehoema@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
3. Re: Brakes? What Brakes
From: Anthony Rinaldi <awrdoc@xxxxxxxxx>
4. RE: Brakes? What Brakes
From: "JONES,DOUG (A-USA,ex3)" <doug_jones@xxxxxxxxxxx>
5. Money?
From: Redwoodlse@xxxxxxx
6. more on modifications
From: John Hertog <crossram@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
7. Re: more on modifications
From: "Ron Waters" <ronbo97@xxxxxxxx>
8. Re: more on modifications
From: "baker.6pack" <Baker.6pack@xxxxxxxxxxx>
9. Re: more on modifications
From: "Brian Hagen" <brian.hagen@xxxxxxxxxxx>
10. Brake modifications and the how to?
From: "Kelly Pierce" <jkrestor300@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
11. WOW!!
From: "The Holmgren's" <paulholm@xxxxxxxx>
12. stopping distances
From: John Hertog <crossram@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
13. Brakes...v.s. Brakes
From: "Jennifer Allyn" <gearhead.girl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
14. 413 Pistons - Where?
From: Chuck McGill <chuxter@xxxxxxxxxx>
15. One more thing...
From: "Jennifer Allyn" <gearhead.girl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 06:45:51 EDT
From: MJMLandDev@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Upgrades to historic cars
Jeff:
There are always exceptions to the rule. Luckily you weren't hurt worse that
you were.
Mike Meyer
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 08:15:09 -0500
From: "Terry & Andree Hoeman" <tehoema@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: new 300 toy
that makes more sense than anything I've come up with yet!
----- Original Message -----
From: "300john" <300john@xxxxxxx>
To: "Larry Carrel" <300fan@xxxxxxxxxx>; "Chrysler 300international, Inc."
<Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; "Terry & Andree Hoeman"
<tehoema@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 10:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] new 300 toy
> Like most of you I've seen the movie several times and can't recall ever
> seeing a Chrysler 300. I can't answer that one, but I can tell you that
> when the Petersen Automotive Museum opened in Los Angeles our C300 was on
> display for the better part of a year and it was probably not more than 20
> feet from the James Bond Aston Martin. There is probably no connection,
but
> I'm reasonably sure no other Letter Car has been that closely associated
> with the real Aston Martin.
>
> John Lazenby
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Terry & Andree Hoeman <tehoema@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: Larry Carrel <300fan@xxxxxxxxxx>; Chrysler 300international, Inc.
> <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 1:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] new 300 toy
>
>
> > Now will someone tell me the connection between Bond, Goldfinger and
the
> 55
> > 300??
> >
> > Watched the movie after this came out and still can't figure out why
this
> > was done except as another way to sell some toys.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Larry Carrel" <300fan@xxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: "Chrysler 300international, Inc." <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2001 3:26 PM
> > Subject: [Chrysler300] new 300 toy
> >
> >
> > > In case I'm not the only one who didn't know about it yet, I thought I
> > should tell you about a new toy from JOHNNY LIGHTNING. It's the James
> Bond
> > 007 Goldfinger set. It's an action scene with James Bond, the oriental
> guy
> > who throws his hat like a lethal Frisbee, and a blond female. James
Bond
> is
> > crouching behind his car, a silver 1964 Aston Martin, pointing a gun at
> the
> > oriental guy who is ready to launch his hat from behind a black C-300.
> Mine
> > cost $7.95 at a Target store.
> > >
> > > Larry Carrel-California
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > To send a message to this group, send an email to:
> > > Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >
> > > For list server instructions, go to
> > http://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >
> >
> >
> > To send a message to this group, send an email to:
> > Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > For list server instructions, go to
> http://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 18:56:47 -0400
From: Anthony Rinaldi <awrdoc@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Brakes? What Brakes
Andy Mikonis' quote is right. "Braking distances have not changed really
much at all,
especially since 1961 Chrysler technology."
My 1999 BMW 740i was tested and stopped from 60mph to 0 in 125 ft. compared
to the 131 ft for the 1961 300-G.
I used to stop a lot faster in 1961 also. All I can speak to is my
experience with my 300-F. All that is currently available are USED brake
drums. The brake shoes (relined or otherwise) are difficult to get and I
wouldn't want to bet that they have the same asbestos content that the shoes
had in 1961. We were lucky to find NOS return springs.
I AM a brake expert! I base it on pushing down the big pedal (next to the
long thin pedal) and seeing how well the car stops AND then stops again.
I drive my 740i to the storage garage. Pull out the 300-F and replace it
with the 740i. After tooling around with the 300-F I reverse the process and
go home with the Beammer.
They both are FAST. But the BMW stops on a dime and the 300 doesn't.
Wish I could go Back to the 1961 in more than one way. I sure had less aches
and pains back then and I bet a 300-F or 300-G would stop a hell of a lot
better back then too. They did, Andy saw it in a 1961 magazine. That proves
it!
Must have been the Good Year "Blue Streak" tires on the test car. You can't
get them any more either you know.
Where do I find those "little" pads and rotors that won't quit? They call
them disc brakes I think!
Tony
ps I had more hair in 1961 too.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 17:34:50 -0600
From: "JONES,DOUG (A-USA,ex3)" <doug_jones@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: Brakes? What Brakes
As with Tony, I alternate between the '63 Pace Car and a '92 Porsche 968.
While I am impressed with Andy's research, there is no way in heck that the
300 even approaches the Porsche in stopping and turning power - or go power,
for that matter. It could be that this is a function of the brake system
being 38 years old, or that the tires are now 'specialty antique' tires
instead of mainline road tires, etc. Whatever, it's a cruiser against a PT
boat, and, as I just love my 300 to pieces, I will continue to drive it with
a great deal of caution. Others may differ ... and that's OK!
For the curious, the 968 does 0 - 60 in 5.6 seconds, top speed 150+, 70 - 0
stop in 162 feet, 0.9 G cornering (Car & Driver test in 1992).
In terms of potential modifications, if I do any, the first would be to go
to a modern split circuit system. The idea that a single leak anywhere in
the system means NO BRAKES scares me silly. Then I might think about disc
brakes in front, but would want to do more research into how much
performance advantage I am likely to get from this. I have rebuilt the
brake system more times than I want to think about in the last 25 years, and
the stopping power of the car has never been better than the 'eventually'
category. Maybe I am doing something wrong, but I could not come near that
1961 figure, and supposedly the '63 had better brakes than a '61 ... or so
Chrysler claimed at the time.
300ly,
Doug
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 19:46:42 EDT
From: Redwoodlse@xxxxxxx
Subject: Money?
Got a pal that won't quibble much more than a little about the price you want
for twoVERY NICE aluminum appliques on the interior driver doors on 300 C
cars. You know, those things that get scratched by my ladies diamonds as she
opened and closed the front doors? Whisper in my ear what it would take for
you to part with one or two.
Larry Jett
950 Woodside Road Suite 4
Redwood City, CA 94061
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 6
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 20:49:01 -0400
From: John Hertog <crossram@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: more on modifications
Gang,
OK, I can't help myself - gotta butt in ! I don't own a Porsche or a
Beemer, and nothing built after 1986 or so..
I did rent a new Volvo something or other recently, and of course I have
driven newer cars of all type, here and there . They just don't turn me on
like my 300F/G's do! But they sure do stop "better" . As in more evenly,
smoothly, straight, time and time again.
My 300L was converted to discs as soon as I bought it. It is a pleasure to
drive, and to STOP. Again and again and again and again at nauseam. And even
with another 4000 lb. Chrysler sitting on the car trailer being towed behind
the 300L. My other 300's, at this time two 300G's, have the original
braking systems, and, well, they sure detract from the driving pleasure I
experience anytime I take one of those cars out. The brakes, and only the
brakes, make these cars feel old and outdated.
It is quite possible to upgrade the handling and steering of a 300 in a
gentle, non-butchering kind of way. The formula is simple: install KYB
shocks front and back, and have Eaton Spring make you a set of new rear
springs, one step heavier duty than stock. Have the steering box rebuilt to
Firm-Feel spec, and install a new steering shaft insulator bushing,
available from Gary Goers. Make sure ALL of your front end components are in
good shape - especially bushings. Then, get some good tires ( I like
Goodyear Eagle GT+4's, P235/75R15, V rated to about 150 mph. ). If you like
to show your car, then just get a second set of rims and switch back and
forth between your "show, bias ply, correct WWWidth tires" and your
"driving, safe radial" tires. Have your car aligned to Mike Laiserin specs -
max caster while still being able to retain camber within spec. You'll now
have a 300 that goes round corners and over bumps and down the road
oh-so-nice !
Likewise it is possible to "upgrade" the original 413 to run on today's
lousy gas - as was pointed out earlier on this listserver, lower the
compression ratio a bit, back off the timing a hair, and, PLEASE, leave
those 2903's and 3505's carbs alone ! They're just fine. If you crave
performance, a little cylinder head porting will bring you back to the
original HP rating. If you crave MORE performance, please don't butcher up
a 300 letter car. Get a 300 sport, Saratoga, etc... and install your fuelie
/ superchargers/ turbochargers on those cars instead. Build a 300 look-alike
like Dean Smith's '61 300R and have a lot of fun with it.
So - all this leads us back to - brakes. Most of us will be content to leave
the original system alone. It's certainly useable. It's safe, too, as long
as ALL your brake lines have been replaced recently and all wheel cylinders
and brake hoses renewed. Anyone out there driving his or her 300 with ANY
original brake line ( now 35 to 45 years old) or brake hose - you've got a
death wish. Replace ALL your steel brake lines - including the front-to-back
one !
Good point about the original drums, especially for 300's up to 1962. I
don't know where to get new ones except for junkyards. Quite a few 300's
that have come thru here in the past couple years have had little or no meat
left on the drums - they're just plain worn down to the cord and are past
the safe/usable stage. The only source of good brake drums that I know of
is salvage yards and / or parts cars. If anyone knows any different,
please - LET ME KNOW ! I need drums for 300F and 300G 's
Both my 300G's have good drums, new shoes, new lines, new wheel cylinders,
hardware and return springs. Shoes have been contour-ground to the drums.
Much care has been taken in bleeding / adjusting/ etc. Both cars feel, well,
inadequate and unsatisfactory in the braking departement.
So - the one issue at hand is: to convert to discs, or not to convert...
it's a personal decision, and there's no right and wrong - you should do to
your car what you want to do to your car. Most people I know won't need disc
brake conversions. They don't drive their 300's far enough, fast enough, or
hard enough. Those that do use their cars on a regular basis, to travel
great distances, and at a high rate of speed whenever possible, might be
tempted to do so. If that is the case, then consider doing it in an
unobtrusive and gentle manner - using the original spindles and a bracket to
mount a caliper attached to said spindles. Such a modification is not
permanent and can be easily reversed, perhaps by the next owner of your 300.
Same story with single versus dual master cylinder setup.
Dan Reitz has performed such mods to his 300F, and it's an impressive
difference over the stock setup. And, the car is NOT butchered or altered -
it could probably be returned to 100% stock configuration in a couple-three
hours. Way to go.
Please - live and let live. Keeping your 300 original is always a safer bet.
It will increase its resale value and you'll be able to say " it's all
original" to all that may ask. If you drive long and hard on today's
highways, in traffic, putting on a few thousand miles each year, it would
seem like common sense to upgrade to disc brakes - it might just save your
life, and certainly will help to preserve your 300, from getting into a bad
accident.
If you must modify, please do so in a gentle, unobtrusive and reversible
manner. These are rare, very special collector cars and should be treated
with the respect they deserve.
John
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 21:31:00 -0400
From: "Ron Waters" <ronbo97@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: more on modifications
John -
I guess it's time to ask a dumb question : Will the disc brake conversion
(such as the one from AAJ) shorten my stopping distance ? I was under the
impression that the major shortcoming of the drum system is that the
friction created by the act of stopping the car causes the drum to heat up.
Repeated hard stopping will result in the brakes not being able to stop the
car based on the overheated drums. The disc system doesn't suffer from this
problem because it's an open air system, so it cools down rapidly. But will
it improve stopping distances ?
Ron
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 8
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 23:28:29 -0700
From: "baker.6pack" <Baker.6pack@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: more on modifications
Hi John,
Forgive me, but I just got to ask. How well did that disc brake conversion
on your sport 300 keep you from getting in a bad accident?
Just teasing you.
K. Baker
----- Original Message -----
From: John Hertog <crossram@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2001 5:49 PM
Subject: [Chrysler300] more on modifications
> Gang,
>
> OK, I can't help myself - gotta butt in ! I don't own a Porsche or a
> Beemer, and nothing built after 1986 or so..
> I did rent a new Volvo something or other recently, and of course I have
> driven newer cars of all type, here and there . They just don't turn me on
> like my 300F/G's do! But they sure do stop "better" . As in more evenly,
> smoothly, straight, time and time again.
>
> My 300L was converted to discs as soon as I bought it. It is a pleasure to
> drive, and to STOP. Again and again and again and again at nauseam. And
even
> with another 4000 lb. Chrysler sitting on the car trailer being towed
behind
> the 300L. My other 300's, at this time two 300G's, have the original
> braking systems, and, well, they sure detract from the driving pleasure I
> experience anytime I take one of those cars out. The brakes, and only the
> brakes, make these cars feel old and outdated.
>
> It is quite possible to upgrade the handling and steering of a 300 in a
> gentle, non-butchering kind of way. The formula is simple: install KYB
> shocks front and back, and have Eaton Spring make you a set of new rear
> springs, one step heavier duty than stock. Have the steering box rebuilt
to
> Firm-Feel spec, and install a new steering shaft insulator bushing,
> available from Gary Goers. Make sure ALL of your front end components are
in
> good shape - especially bushings. Then, get some good tires ( I like
> Goodyear Eagle GT+4's, P235/75R15, V rated to about 150 mph. ). If you
like
> to show your car, then just get a second set of rims and switch back and
> forth between your "show, bias ply, correct WWWidth tires" and your
> "driving, safe radial" tires. Have your car aligned to Mike Laiserin
specs -
> max caster while still being able to retain camber within spec. You'll now
> have a 300 that goes round corners and over bumps and down the road
> oh-so-nice !
>
> Likewise it is possible to "upgrade" the original 413 to run on today's
> lousy gas - as was pointed out earlier on this listserver, lower the
> compression ratio a bit, back off the timing a hair, and, PLEASE, leave
> those 2903's and 3505's carbs alone ! They're just fine. If you crave
> performance, a little cylinder head porting will bring you back to the
> original HP rating. If you crave MORE performance, please don't butcher
up
> a 300 letter car. Get a 300 sport, Saratoga, etc... and install your
fuelie
> / superchargers/ turbochargers on those cars instead. Build a 300
look-alike
> like Dean Smith's '61 300R and have a lot of fun with it.
>
> So - all this leads us back to - brakes. Most of us will be content to
leave
> the original system alone. It's certainly useable. It's safe, too, as long
> as ALL your brake lines have been replaced recently and all wheel
cylinders
> and brake hoses renewed. Anyone out there driving his or her 300 with ANY
> original brake line ( now 35 to 45 years old) or brake hose - you've got a
> death wish. Replace ALL your steel brake lines - including the
front-to-back
> one !
>
> Good point about the original drums, especially for 300's up to 1962. I
> don't know where to get new ones except for junkyards. Quite a few 300's
> that have come thru here in the past couple years have had little or no
meat
> left on the drums - they're just plain worn down to the cord and are past
> the safe/usable stage. The only source of good brake drums that I know of
> is salvage yards and / or parts cars. If anyone knows any different,
> please - LET ME KNOW ! I need drums for 300F and 300G 's
>
> Both my 300G's have good drums, new shoes, new lines, new wheel cylinders,
> hardware and return springs. Shoes have been contour-ground to the drums.
> Much care has been taken in bleeding / adjusting/ etc. Both cars feel,
well,
> inadequate and unsatisfactory in the braking departement.
>
> So - the one issue at hand is: to convert to discs, or not to convert...
> it's a personal decision, and there's no right and wrong - you should do
to
> your car what you want to do to your car. Most people I know won't need
disc
> brake conversions. They don't drive their 300's far enough, fast enough,
or
> hard enough. Those that do use their cars on a regular basis, to travel
> great distances, and at a high rate of speed whenever possible, might be
> tempted to do so. If that is the case, then consider doing it in an
> unobtrusive and gentle manner - using the original spindles and a bracket
to
> mount a caliper attached to said spindles. Such a modification is not
> permanent and can be easily reversed, perhaps by the next owner of your
300.
> Same story with single versus dual master cylinder setup.
>
> Dan Reitz has performed such mods to his 300F, and it's an impressive
> difference over the stock setup. And, the car is NOT butchered or
altered -
> it could probably be returned to 100% stock configuration in a
couple-three
> hours. Way to go.
>
> Please - live and let live. Keeping your 300 original is always a safer
bet.
> It will increase its resale value and you'll be able to say " it's all
> original" to all that may ask. If you drive long and hard on today's
> highways, in traffic, putting on a few thousand miles each year, it would
> seem like common sense to upgrade to disc brakes - it might just save your
> life, and certainly will help to preserve your 300, from getting into a
bad
> accident.
>
> If you must modify, please do so in a gentle, unobtrusive and reversible
> manner. These are rare, very special collector cars and should be treated
> with the respect they deserve.
>
> John
>
>
>
> To send a message to this group, send an email to:
> Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> For list server instructions, go to
http://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 9
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 22:42:36 -0400
From: "Brian Hagen" <brian.hagen@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: more on modifications
----- Original Message -----
From: "baker.6pack" <Baker.6pack@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> Hi John,
>
> Forgive me, but I just got to ask. How well did that disc brake
conversion
> on your sport 300 keep you from getting in a bad accident?
> Just teasing you.
Well, i don't know about the disc brakes, but I do know that not driving my
300 has stopped me from getting in any accidents. Also, not juggling
chainsaws has prevented me from cuttin off my arm while juggling chainsaws.
;-)
Brian
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 10
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 20:39:12 -0600
From: "Kelly Pierce" <jkrestor300@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Brake modifications and the how to?
I have been reading w/ great interest all the debate on these mods. What I would like to know is; What parts need to be changed and what car can be used as a donor? I am building a "one of none" 300 sport town and country wagon out of a 64 Newport wagon. I plan on using this car as a summer and fall parts hauler when I don't need a 4x4 pickup to make the trip and get around in the yards etc. Anyone who has been in a wrecking yard during the winter or spring "gumbo" season in Montana will know why this car will be a summer/ fall parts hauler!!!!!!!! So what master cyl works, what booster , spindles. rotors etc etc. I do not plan on doing any mods on my K as I do want to keep it original and the brake system is all overhauled etc. at this point. I do plan on putting new drums on this winter front and rear as that is all that is left to do to have it as new so to speak. Any assistance would be much appreciated.
Joe Pierce.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 11
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 22:39:19 -0500
From: "The Holmgren's" <paulholm@xxxxxxxx>
Subject: WOW!!
Talk about being able to go fast!! BUT SAFE????????????
ebay item number 596273198
you can plug the number here
http://pages.ebay.com/search/items/search_item.html
--
Paul Holmgren
Hoosier Corps #33, L-6
2 57 300-C's in Indy
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 12
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 23:58:37 -0400
From: John Hertog <crossram@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: stopping distances
Hi Ron,
Good question, about stopping distances. A few months back I went thru some
period car magazines and charted stopping distances for our cars, as
reported by Car Life, Road and Track, HotRod, etc. ; sixty-to-zero type of
stuff. I then compared to stopping distances for current cars as reported
in same magazines road tests.
I was VERY surprised to see that there was little or no difference between
the two! I'm not prepared to start the research process all over again,
you'll have to take my word as to the results, or do your own homework.
To be fair, I also remember the comments from these same period magazines,
describing the brakes as inadequate, prone to fade, not on par with the rest
of the cars' performance, etc .; so it seems that while the 300's did have
adequate zero-to-sixty stopping power, they somehow displeased the
magazine's testers.
It appears possible that a Chrysler 300 with a good braking system will stop
in the same distance than a new, current, disc-brake and ABS equipped sedan.
At least, on a one-time basis. I doubt this performance could be repeated
when the drum brakes get hot. Of course, it can be argued that you only
need ONE good stop if you have to jam on the brakes in an emergency.
My point, if I have one, is that disc brakes just work more smoothly,
evenly, and reliably, especially after multiple use, especially after they
have seen some use. They don't need periodic shoe adjustement. I installed
discs on my 300L some 30,000 VERY HARD miles ago and, so far, same pads are
still on the car. I've never had to mess with the system in 30,000 miles.
I've never regretted installing them. But, as I stated earlier, this car is
a real driver, not an occasional weekend / fair weather ride.
Kevin, you are quite right with your comments, by the way. It is entirely
possible that if my beloved '62 300 Sport had not been disc-brake equipped
and such a blast to drive, I might have just left it home and driven my
Subaru Brat instead. Of course, had that been the case, I'd be dead right
now. The speeding SUV that broadsided me at 60+ mph didn't seem to care that
I was driving at 5 mph, or had disc brakes on my car.
John
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Message: 13
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 21:45:53 -0700
From: "Jennifer Allyn" <gearhead.girl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Brakes...v.s. Brakes
I have to say something about modifications...
I believe that low-production, high value cars should not be significantly
modified. Our 300s fall into that category. I bought a '55 Cadillac
Eldorado Convertible from a woman who sold it to us at a lower price because
we had plans to restore it to stock condition. Her other offers came from
people who wished to customize it. We were aghast at the thought, as was
she. However, I think the fundamental question on modifications on the 300
brakes is how you use the car and how well you can do the modification.
I have a '62 300 and a '62 New Yorker Station Wagon. I would never think to
customize or significantly modify either of these cars. (My husband's '50
Chevy is modified in every which way...who cares? as they are a dime a
dozen.) However I have put disc brakes on both my 300 and my wagon. The
300, I drove daily for the last 12 years commuting on the LA freeways two
hours each day. I have put 170,000 miles on my 300 personally and with a
little help from my husband. I feel that the amount of time I spent on the
road that I can attest the cars don't stop well for an hour in bumper to
bumper traffic. They stop really well once or twice...but after that there
is significant fade. I was not the first to notice this. The magazines
that road tested the '62 300H mention the braking system as sub-par on an
otherwise above par car. The question is not whether or not I should have
modified the braking system...whether or not my use of the car justifies
that modification. My use of my 300 is extreme in comparison with most
club members. I drive the hell out of the car negotiating the freeways. I
love to go fast and coming home late at night from LA I set the car at a 110
mph. and cruise the 30 miles of open road hoping that some drunk doesn't
pull in front of me. If he does, I feel that my disc brakes and radial
tires give me a better chance. I also know that bumper to bumper crawl
means that I am using the brakes continuously and that is where I really
feel the disc brakes have given me a huge advantage over the original drum
brakes. Secondly, I think that a disc brake conversion should be done so
that the modification is minimized. I used the original single well master
cylinder and I feel that most would be hard pressed to find the modification
without climbing under the car.
I realize that most of these cars are not used daily, year round. I don't
show my cars at concours events...if much at all. I show my cars on the
freeway to the other motorists who pull in front of me and stop short. I
don't think there is any right answer but your own. The answer on whether
to modify your brakes should be derived from what you intend to do with the
car. I found my very own right answer...that is just for me.
Jennifer Allyn
P.S. When I put radial tires on my car, I was shocked by the difference in
handling. I told my husband it felt like a whole new car. I loved it! He
doubted that such a change would make the huge difference I was describing.
He was in favor of keeping the bias ply tires, until he drove it. It is a
huge difference and I found that it tightened the feel of the handling and
kept it from slipping around the freeway lanes at higher speeds. It drove
like I have always felt the 300s should tight and responsive...less floating
land yatchy...more modern sport car-like, like the ads touted in 1962.
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Message: 14
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 21:57:49 -0700
From: Chuck McGill <chuxter@xxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: 413 Pistons - Where?
Hi Gang,
I believe I know the answer to this question but I promised my friend
that I would check . His New Yorker is in need of 413 pistons, 30 over.
Where might I direct him to purchase them.
Hoping they are not made of unobtainium ;-)
Chuck
'62 300H
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Message: 15
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 21:57:57 -0700
From: "Jennifer Allyn" <gearhead.girl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: One more thing...
After I sent my email, my husband pointed out that the cars are getting dual
wells with proportioning values as soon as we find the time to do it. (We
have a toddler and newborn, time is precious as is sleep). I still believe
that our modifications have been done to make it look as stock as possible
while enabling superior stopping power...even with a dual well master.
Jennifer
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