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Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards
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   Forward Look NON-Technical Discussions -> 1955-1961 Forward Look MoPar General DiscussionMessage format
 
jimntempe
Posted 2015-11-14 3:02 PM (#495162 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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wizard
Posted 2015-11-14 3:03 PM (#495163 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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58 DESOTOS RULE
Posted 2015-11-15 2:40 AM (#495207 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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The Marilyn Monroe pictures appear to show her sitting in a 1960-61 Chrysler convertible in spite of the original poster saying that she wasn't sitting in a FL car. Yet if you blow up the picture that has the driver's door open, it certainly seems as if that's an Astrodome instrument cluster. I agree though with the OP that any picture of Marilyn Monroe is worth posting no matter the subject as she was such an attractive woman. 





(Marilyn Monroe FL.jpg)



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wizard
Posted 2015-11-15 3:16 AM (#495208 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Chrycoman
Posted 2015-11-15 4:10 AM (#495212 - in reply to #495208)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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The Astrodome was used on 1960-1962 Chryslers, so you can't tell by blowing up Marilyn's legs.

Now, if you look at the two photos that do not show her legs, you can see the car with the door closed. And the fact that the car is finless. Thus a 1962 model.

I'm another one who likes to view the 1962 Chrysler as a Forward Look car. After all, the only the rear quarter panels and taillamps were new with the rest of the car actually a 1961 Dodge Polara with a 1960-61 Chrysler instrument panel and the 1961 Chrysler front clip. Also, the 1962 Chrysler was designed under Virgil Exner.





(mm2.jpg)



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mstrug
Posted 2015-11-15 6:05 AM (#495214 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth)		I agree, look at the windshield and vent window assembly. It dates back to 1957 on Imperials and convertibles.



(57plyconvred1.jpg)



(57plyconvred2.jpg)



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Islander 62
Posted 2015-11-15 4:24 PM (#495256 - in reply to #495212)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards


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Chrycoman - 2015-11-15 1:10 AM


The Astrodome was used on 1960-1962 Chryslers, so you can't tell by blowing up Marilyn's legs.

Now, if you look at the two photos that do not show her legs, you can see the car with the door closed. And the fact that the car is finless. Thus a 1962 model.

I'm another one who likes to view the 1962 Chrysler as a Forward Look car. After all, the only the rear quarter panels and taillamps were new with the rest of the car actually a 1961 Dodge Polara with a 1960-61 Chrysler instrument panel and the 1961 Chrysler front clip. Also, the 1962 Chrysler was designed under Virgil Exner.

You're right, I owned a white 'H' convertible over 30 years ago and this is one that I have known about for as many years. MM did a huge photo shoot in this 'H' and it's really well known. As for the question of wether or not the '62's are FL cars, as far as I'm concerned, they are, no one but Virgil could be responsible for such a stunning design. Exner has his mark all over the '62's......I have a few '62's as well as a '58 Imperial and they're both FL from start to finish.
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2015-11-15 4:47 PM (#495262 - in reply to #495256)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Parts Unknown		They are Forward Look cars right up to the blunted sheetmetal purposely
made to cover up the genuinely Forward Look fins. To overlook this is to
not acknowledge just how integral the fins were to Exner's run at Chrysler
Corp. Just because it has bread and mayo does not a pastrami sandwich
make.
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Viper Guy
Posted 2015-11-15 11:56 PM (#495305 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Branson, MO		The '55s didn't have fins nor did the '61 Plymouth and they are in the FL category. I personally think the '62s that were carried over from the same FL bodies of their prior year should be considered FL's. Just my opinion - and as everyone knows, we all have 'em.

"It's delightful, it's delovely, it's DeSoto"

Edited by Viper Guy 2015-11-16 12:09 AM
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2015-11-16 12:48 AM (#495311 - in reply to #495305)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Parts Unknown		What 61 did not have fins ? Just because they were vertical doesn't make
them not fins. Granted, they are different, but they aren't purposefully designed
nubs like the 62 big body cars got.

Besides, Exner himself is the one quoted as disliking what they had done to
his design/s. If Ex don't claim it or like it, I'd say there is no higher authority
on what is and is not a Forward Look car.
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Chrycoman
Posted 2015-11-16 3:16 AM (#495321 - in reply to #495311)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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The 1961 Plymouth had no fins. Although it came close . . .

Neither did the first year of the Forward Look - 1955. The 1962 Imperial used the 1961 design with the fins removed and was the last year for the "sparrow strainer" taillamps, which in 1962 was an update of the original 1955 style.

I have always wondered about Exner's comment on the 1962 Chryslers. He was the man in charge, and the rear quarters were the result of having to use the rear doors of the 1961 Polara with its character crease 2/3's of the way down the door. The styling people were wondering how they could use the door and have it blend in with the rear quarter panel. Now, if you want to see a real plucked chicken, check out Exner's initial designs for the 1962 Chrysler and DeSoto. As wrth the previous years, DeSoto and Chrysler shared rear quarter panels and used the taillamps as the way to make the cars look different.

The Valiants, Lancers, 1962 Plymouth and 1962 Dodge Dart/Polara are definitely not Forward Look and were based on Exner's ideas for what was to follow the Forward Look.

Even the instrument panels of the 1962 Chrysler, Dodge Custom 880, and 1962 Imperial were basically the 1961 designs (1960 in the case of Chrysler and Dodge) carried forward one more year. The designs used on Valiants, Lancers, and the 1962 Plymouth and Dodges Dart/Polara had a panel that was set away from the passengers with the instruments in a box placed in front of the driver. The same panel would be used on the 1963 Plymouths and Dodges while the new Valiants and Darts adopted a more mainstream design that was pleasant, but boring.





(1961 Plymouth Fury - Rejected.jpg)



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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-16 9:14 AM (#495345 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Plymouth



(10336800_682015115179341_3736530299988143690_n.jpg)



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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2015-11-16 10:04 AM (#495349 - in reply to #495345)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Parts Unknown		OK, FOMOCO people, ... what's the deal with the elliptical tail lights on the
Merc ? I have only see round ones like what Comets wore.
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58coupe
Posted 2015-11-16 10:43 AM (#495352 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Alaska		OK Doc were you sleeping in 1962? I believe that is a 62 Merc full size car and that's the style tail lights they wore.
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RDP
Posted 2015-11-16 11:18 AM (#495353 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Chrycoman
Posted 2015-11-16 12:15 PM (#495358 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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That's actually a 1961 Mercury Meteor 600 2 door sedan, a model sold only in the U.S.

The 1960 Mercury came as Monterey, Montclair and Park Lane, all on a 126" wheelbase. For 1961 the line was slashed, dropping the upper two lines and placing the Monterey on a 120" wheelbase with the Ford Galaxie body. Mercury was adding the new mid-size Meteor in 1962 and decided to offer two lower-priced full size models - Meteor 600 and Meteor 800. Both had Ford's six cylinder as standard with a choice of three optional V8 engines. The Meteor 800 sedans and hardtops used the Thunderbird roof line as used on the Monterey but the Meteor 600 sedans used a large wraparound rear window as used on the 1960 Ford Fairlane and Fairlane 500 series. The Meteor 600 also offered the Commuter wagon.

The 1961 Mercury Meteor 600 used the elliptical taillights while the Meteor 800 used the Monterey round ones. The Mercury Meteor 600/800 were not available in Canada as Canadian Mercury-Meteor dealers had the Ford-based Meteor to sell.

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59 explorer
Posted 2015-11-16 12:20 PM (#495359 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards


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Location: Hershey PA		It is a 1961 Meteor 600. In 61 Mercury inched closer to Ford dropping the Park Lane and Montclair series making the Monterey the top of the line with the Meteor 800 and Meteor 600 behind. The 600 is obviously based on the entry level Ford and I believe it was available with a 6
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Chrycoman
Posted 2015-11-16 4:30 PM (#495374 - in reply to #495359)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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The Canadian 1961 Meteor. It was replaced by the new intermediate Mercury Meteor for 1962-63, and reappeared in 1964 as just Meteor using the Mercury body with Ford instrument panels and interiors.





(1961 Meteor Montcalm 4dr Hardtop 1.jpg)



(1961 Meteor Rideau 500 4dr Sedan 1.jpg)



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Valiant_200
Posted 2015-11-17 3:45 AM (#495411 - in reply to #495321)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Chrycoman - 2015-11-16 2:16 AM

The Valiants, Lancers, 1962 Plymouth and 1962 Dodge Dart/Polara are definitely not Forward Look and were based on Exner's ideas for what was to follow the Forward Look.



I disagree. I believe that 60-62 Valiants are very much Forward Look.
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1960fury
Posted 2015-11-17 8:12 AM (#495419 - in reply to #495411)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Valiant_200 - 2015-11-17 3:45 AM



I disagree. I believe that 60-62 Valiants are very much Forward Look.


what makes you think so? they do not follow the late 50s fashion in car design at all. they look as if they were 60s eastern bloc cars or fiats. very "european", very anti jetson/american. if you like them, fine, tastes are different but these are really not forwardlook.
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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-17 8:30 AM (#495422 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Desoto and Plymouth



(57 DeSoto.jpg)



(57 Ply.jpg)



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1960fury
Posted 2015-11-17 8:46 AM (#495426 - in reply to #495422)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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(ozzie61.jpg)



(ail_570xN.698665327_k3is.jpg)



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wizard
Posted 2015-11-17 8:51 AM (#495427 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island		Very nice pictures guys, thanks' for sharing!
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Valiant_200
Posted 2015-11-17 1:10 PM (#495442 - in reply to #495419)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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1960fury - 2015-11-17 7:12 AM

Valiant_200 - 2015-11-17 3:45 AM



I disagree. I believe that 60-62 Valiants are very much Forward Look.


what makes you think so? they do not follow the late 50s fashion in car design at all. they look as if they were 60s eastern bloc cars or fiats. very "european", very anti jetson/american. if you like them, fine, tastes are different but these are really not forwardlook.


Let's consider the evidence:

-Design for the Valiant began in 57, in the midst of Forward Look mania.

-Virgil Exner was deeply involved in the design of the Valiant.

-The front clip of the 60-62 series Valiant borrows heavily from the 57 Chrysler 300c

-They were sold at Plymouth dealerships, right alongside other Forward Look cars.

-The factory original aluminum keys for the 60-62 Valiants have a Forward Look logo stamped in the heads.

-The Forward Look logo appears on nearly every part that was cast for them. From the windows, where it is nicely etched in a corner of each pane, to the cover for the park pawl on the transmission. The appearance of the Forward Look logo is one of the things I love about these cars.

-The 60-61 Valiants sported a large "toilet seat" fake spare tire on the trunk lid, like numerous years of Imperial and Plymouth.

Before I make the next observation, allow me to quote one of my favorite commenters on this board. A man for whom I have great respect as one who appreciated these cars long before they were cool, Dr. DeSoto:

"What 61 did not have fins ? Just because they were vertical doesn't make
them not fins. Granted, they are different, but they aren't purposefully designed
nubs like the 62 big body cars got."

With that declaration on the record, I hereby declare the 60-62 Valiants to be finned! Granted, in 62 they deleted those gorgeous cat-eye tail lights in favor of a pair of distinctly GM looking rounds, but the fins remained! Take that, rest of 62 MoPar lineup!

Here's one more point to ponder. Valiant carried the vestiges of fins longer than any other Chrysler product, all the way through the 66 model year. 63-64 had fairly tall stumps, which were shortened for 65-66.
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1960fury
Posted 2015-11-17 1:31 PM (#495445 - in reply to #495442)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Valiant_200 - 2015-11-17 1:10 PM

Let's consider the evidence:

-Design for the Valiant began in 57, in the midst of Forward Look mania.

-Virgil Exner was deeply involved in the design of the Valiant.

-The front clip of the 60-62 series Valiant borrows heavily from the 57 Chrysler 300c

-They were sold at Plymouth dealerships, right alongside other Forward Look cars.

-The factory original aluminum keys for the 60-62 Valiants have a Forward Look logo stamped in the heads.

-The Forward Look logo appears on nearly every part that was cast for them. From the windows, where it is nicely etched in a corner of each pane, to the cover for the park pawl on the transmission. The appearance of the Forward Look logo is one of the things I love about these cars.

-The 60-61 Valiants sported a large "toilet seat" fake spare tire on the trunk lid, like numerous years of Imperial and Plymouth.



so these "evidence", completely unrelated to the actual shape an proportion of the cars, makes them boxy valiants fl? so every car that has a ridiculous fake spare tire is a fl? i bought some nos oe trim parts for my 60 some time ago in pentastar boxes. so? a simple logo does not change a design concept. if you print a fl logo on a yugo it does not become a fl.


Edited by 1960fury 2015-11-17 1:32 PM
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wizard
Posted 2015-11-17 2:14 PM (#495453 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island		Well, Virgil Exner patented the complete Valiant design in June 13 1961.

"1960 Valiant. All of Exner's styling themes were apparant on the Valiant; sculpted body, fully open wheelarches, large greenhouse, long hood and short deck and the ubiquitous trash can spare wheel stamp on the trunk"

As early as 1957, Chrysler had been thinking about building a compact, and by May 1958 had set up the Small Car Study Program, headed by Harry Chesebrough, to develop a car ready for release in 1962.......

In a Product planning meeting held on 8th July 1958, Chesebrough and Ex showed two full size clay models, one with a wheelbase of 106in and the other with a 103in base, both wearing Falcon nameplates.

The text above is exerptions from the book Virgil Exner Visioneer by Peter Grist.

Obviously, the Valiant was planned and designed in the midst of the FL era for to be presented 1962, but was released already in 1960.

Forward Look or not??
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1960fury
Posted 2015-11-17 3:09 PM (#495459 - in reply to #495453)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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wizard - 2015-11-17 2:14 PM

Forward Look or not??


its just a marketing slogan. a 59 buick or 57 lincoln premiere is as much "forwardlook" as a 60 plymouth or chrysler. FACT is design wise valiants have NOTHING in common with the typical late 50s long and low rocketship design. i remember when my ex girfriend (desotogirl ) saw the valiant for the 1rst time, she couldn't believe its a mopar. she said, in disgust, that looks like a eastern bloc car and she was right.
i remember the retired ex chrysler designer (that worked under exner, forgot his name) saying here that the valiant was the ONLY car exner designed all by his own. still that does not change the look of the car.
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1960fury
Posted 2015-11-17 4:34 PM (#495463 - in reply to #495459)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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(0_i35_riverside_may_1957.jpg)



(0sams.jpg)



(059.jpg)



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wizard
Posted 2015-11-17 4:58 PM (#495466 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island		Well Sid, there's a reason why we call them "toads"

There was a time when those cars hurt my eyes, but with time and the "modern" deigned cars all looking like suppositorys, I like them more.

There's the leaning Tower of Power, a pushbutton transmission and actually space inside.

I could think of having a Valiant as winter car, butwith a Suregrip rear axle
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1960fury
Posted 2015-11-17 5:50 PM (#495471 - in reply to #495466)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: northern germany		these were good cars! few people know the 60 "hi per packs" went from 0-60 in 6 seconds. yet they are so ugly i wouldn't touch them. i prefer the later valiants. in 1960 mercury showed with the comet that you can build compact cars that look nice.
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sidesho_bob1961
Posted 2015-11-18 6:17 AM (#495516 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Fleetwood, Pa		Lets not bring up Mercurys.....they have nothing to do with FL Mopars.....
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christine-lover
Posted 2015-11-18 6:37 AM (#495517 - in reply to #495516)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Sept. 1958		59 Desoto



(image.jpg)



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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-18 8:24 AM (#495522 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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On Girard Ave at Broad St Philadelphia PA 1964



(Philadelphia PA 1964.jpg)



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RDP
Posted 2015-11-18 12:30 PM (#495540 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: PL / EU		Dodge



(55-1.jpg)



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soiouz
Posted 2015-11-18 1:15 PM (#495548 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Montreal, Canada		"You Auto Buy Now" campaign, 1958.



(h157-1.jpg)



(h157-5.jpg)



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mstrug
Posted 2015-11-19 7:50 AM (#495614 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth)		1957 Plymouth on a hauler:





(57plyonhaulerbandw.jpg)



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Peter Panov
Posted 2015-11-19 9:12 AM (#495619 - in reply to #495040)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards


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Yes spinout you are right! I've not seen these cars in Bulgaria. I've seen these cars in the US, during my visits there.
We both know 2-dr HT and the convertibles are the most attractive and this is what I used to see most.
I only wanted to point that I regret that not too many of the middle and cheaper versions survived nowadays, because they give a better idea what was more common as transportation in those days.
Regards

Edited by Peter Panov 2015-11-19 9:15 AM
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mstrug
Posted 2015-11-19 10:08 AM (#495623 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth)		1957 on Cannon Beach Ore.





(57plymouthbeach.jpg)



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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-19 12:57 PM (#495628 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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57 Plymouth



(57 Plymouth.jpg)



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mstrug
Posted 2015-11-19 12:59 PM (#495629 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth)		He doesn't seem very happy with his purchase. Marc.

Edited by mstrug 2015-11-19 1:01 PM
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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-20 8:34 AM (#495704 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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61 Dodge



(61 dod.jpg)



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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-21 6:54 AM (#495752 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Desoto wagon



(DeSoto wagon.jpg)



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soiouz
Posted 2015-11-21 7:32 AM (#495753 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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(12239874_10153624344929543_6773712971643772013_n.jpg)



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60crossram
Posted 2015-11-21 10:30 AM (#495765 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Layton, Utah		No, he's just thinking about the little girl taking the picture while he's sporting a wood.
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1960fury
Posted 2015-11-22 9:38 AM (#495846 - in reply to #495614)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



Expert 5K+

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Location: northern germany		.

Edited by 1960fury 2015-11-22 3:37 PM




(0-ronan.mt.jpg)



(0sams.jpg)



(0-savannah.jpg)



(61chicago.jpg)



(bhhthen.JPG)



(bhh.jpg)



(culvercity1958.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments 0-ronan.mt.jpg (59KB - 198 downloads)
Attachments 0sams.jpg (89KB - 200 downloads)
Attachments 0-savannah.jpg (369KB - 184 downloads)
Attachments 61chicago.jpg (35KB - 196 downloads)
Attachments bhhthen.JPG (177KB - 200 downloads)
Attachments bhh.jpg (380KB - 203 downloads)
Attachments culvercity1958.jpg (85KB - 200 downloads)
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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-22 9:42 AM (#495849 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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September 1964



(55 Plymouth Sept 1964.jpg)



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Attachments 55 Plymouth Sept 1964.jpg (344KB - 213 downloads)
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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-22 4:03 PM (#495881 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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I'm posting these photos for our fellow member 59 explorer



(bob.jpg)



(bob2.jpg)



(bob3.jpg)



(bob4.jpg)



(bob5.jpg)



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Attachments bob.jpg (234KB - 195 downloads)
Attachments bob2.jpg (113KB - 198 downloads)
Attachments bob3.jpg (228KB - 192 downloads)
Attachments bob4.jpg (149KB - 204 downloads)
Attachments bob5.jpg (205KB - 203 downloads)
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hemidenis
Posted 2015-11-22 7:46 PM (#495895 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: Re: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



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Location: Northen Virginia		Miss Kennedy boarding Airforce one that sad day in Dallas, TX



(20151122_193727.jpg)



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Attachments 20151122_193727.jpg (91KB - 212 downloads)
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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-24 9:37 AM (#496052 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



Expert

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55s



(55 Chrysler.jpg)



(55 Dodge.jpg)



(55 DeSoto.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments 55 Chrysler.jpg (143KB - 201 downloads)
Attachments 55 Dodge.jpg (185KB - 211 downloads)
Attachments 55 DeSoto.jpg (144KB - 202 downloads)
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hemidave
Posted 2015-11-25 9:29 AM (#496150 - in reply to #81647)
Subject: RE: Forwardlooks in old pictures/postcards



Expert

Posts: 4654
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Plymouth



(1468567_496212223825412_395446426_n.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments 1468567_496212223825412_395446426_n.jpg (157KB - 192 downloads)
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