The Forward Look Network | ||
| ||
2nd '60 Seneca Jump to page : 1 2 Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page] | View previous thread :: View next thread |
Forward Look NON-Technical Discussions -> Members Rides | Message format |
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | Just picked this one up today. She's powered by a turbocharged slant 6. This car has been for sale for quite some time. Finally came down to earth on the price.
| ||
Mike McCandless |
| ||
Expert Posts: 1886 | Love it! | ||
DIF-RNT |
| ||
Location: NE Ohio | Nice........... | ||
ttotired |
| ||
Expert 5K+ Posts: 8445 Location: Perth Australia | I watched that one on ebay, they did want a lot for it, but then, they have put a lot of work into it I think I saved all the pics of it from ebay, I liked what he did I turbo'd an old 6cyl once, wasnt to hard to do and went well | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I'm very pleased with the car overall, however the car is dead gutless until the rpms come up. The rear end ratio feels like a 2.73 maybe a 3:23 at best. Biggest problem is that the engine is stalling after slowing to make a 90 deg right hand turn. Engine is so quiet and smooth when it's running down the road that I can't even feel that the engine stall until I hit the go pedal. I've tried to bump start it while it's rolling, but that hasn't worked. It seems to want to sit for a 30secs or more before it will fire up again. Almost seems like it's going rich. Maybe a mis-adjusted or sticky float. It has a 4bbl Holley vacuum secondary carb. I think the problem may be due to a bad connection at the intake. The seller pointed out that the intake tube wasn't well formed and occasionally leaked. I've already ordered a new piece to replace it with. | ||
ttotired |
| ||
Expert 5K+ Posts: 8445 Location: Perth Australia | Looking at the distance the fuel has to travel, my thoughts is that by the time it gets to the intake, that the fuel is no longer atomised. Not sure how you would fix it, but maybe a smaller diameter pipe from the carb to the turbo (if you keep it a draw through) Another (painfull) option would be to re configure the set up to a blow through (I have not done this myself), but it does involve the need for a higher fuel pressure and a bit of stuffing around makeing a box to enclose the carby ect. On mine, I had the carby mounted almost directly at the turbo intake to try and keep everything as shot as possible. I used the biggest S U carb that I could get I dont think I have a pic of it though (Idid this about 20 years ago) Another more modern option would be a centre port fuel injection system that would be much easier to make a blow through out of and has the advantage of not putting fuel through the turbo (theyre not really designed for that anyway) Just a few ideas, hope it helps ($(KGrHqJHJDQE-n28fkIhBPu,QF73s!~~60_12.jpg) Attachments ---------------- $(KGrHqJHJDQE-n28fkIhBPu,QF73s!~~60_12.jpg (53KB - 304 downloads) | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I've been digging around the 'net a bit and found that if the powervalve is not receiving vacuum from the correct location it can go lean in part throttle conditions. This may be the problem... I do agree with everything you said about running the drawthrough setup. It's definitely not ideal, but for now it is what it is and I'll tinker a bit until I convince myself that it's not going to work for me
BTW, your attachment didn't come across properly. Edited by ab7fh 2013-03-13 1:39 AM | ||
Doctor DeSoto |
| ||
Location: Parts Unknown | Too dammed cool. | ||
PlymouthFury |
| ||
Expert Posts: 1324 Location: Hickory, NC | It's definitely a unique car. Any pics of the engine bay? What transmission is in her? | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | It has a 4 speed manual tranny with OD. Not sure on the model, as I have only run Mopar auto trannies until now. I'll take some pictures of the engine. Right now I only have the one that was part of the ad for the car.
Edited by ab7fh 2013-03-13 11:35 AM (3E93Kc3Ff5Ld5Kf5H2d2d31db741af1631ec9.jpg) Attachments ---------------- 3E93Kc3Ff5Ld5Kf5H2d2d31db741af1631ec9.jpg (1KB - 272 downloads) | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | Very productive day today. Pulled the carb, cleaned and re-gasketed it. I also performed a modification I found on theturboforum which said to flip the spring in the vacuum secondary for drawthrough blower/turbo applications. Car runs much, much better. No more dying out and it's nowhere near as doggy off the line. Feels pretty normal now. Only issue is when you really step on it, it bogs a bit. I really think it needs a double pumper with the secondary accelerator pump. Oh yeah... I thew a bigger pump squirter in the front which helped, but not enough to cover the bog completely. Next order of business is to go through the wiring and fix some sketchy looking connections. | ||
oldwood |
| ||
Expert Posts: 2905 Location: little rock, AR | I read about this car on the /6 forum. That is a great looking car. | ||
Doctor DeSoto |
| ||
Location: Parts Unknown | Please update us on fuel consumption as you get it dialed in and driving. I would find it very interesting to learn what a set up like this can do. | ||
FIN ME |
| ||
Expert Posts: 2788 Location: USA - KY | VERY cool car, Rick! Congrats! Hope you get her running the way that you want, and start tearing up the streets asap! | ||
PlymouthFury |
| ||
Expert Posts: 1324 Location: Hickory, NC | The 4spd w/ overdrive most likely came out of a 70's era car/truck. Depending on the rear end it can be a really nice setup. | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I was under the car today. The date code on the tranny says 79. Lower gears are in store for this car. I did a quick spin of the rear end and the it's almost dead on 3:1. It cruises at 2000 rpms at 60+ mph. It really needs lower gears to help it off the line. Motor mounts and tranny mounts are gone. I already ordered new motor mounts. The tranny mount is a custom setup and I'm gong to redo it. Not to pretty as is... | ||
Doctor DeSoto |
| ||
Location: Parts Unknown | Slow down, Buddy. You're making the rest of us look like slackers ! | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I've been keeping our UPS driver busy with shipments from Amazon and E-bay. I replaced the motor mounts yesterday. The right side motor mount was ripped. The left side mount lost the one nut that had held it in place. There was nothing to keep the engine from flopping around which was very evident every time I let out the clutch. I also sprung for a new carburetor. I purchased a new Holley 600 double pumper that's built for a draw through supercharger setup. The only difference is where the power valve gets it's vacuum from. I made two quick tuning attempts and it's running much better than with the vacuum secondary carb. This beauty is a real cruiser. It has no problem at 70mph running straight and true. Oh and speaking of 70, I'm having to use an app in my cell phone as a speedo since the dash mounted speedo isn't working. | ||
ttotired |
| ||
Expert 5K+ Posts: 8445 Location: Perth Australia | Just buy a cheap gps Come in handy anyway My guess on the speedo is because of the later tranny, the cable wouldnt fit anymore | ||
oldwood |
| ||
Expert Posts: 2905 Location: little rock, AR | I glad to see your excited about having a little SLANTY!!! Nothing like having some SLANTY to make ya smile. | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | ttotired - 2013-03-20 4:27 AM Just buy a cheap gps Come in handy anyway My guess on the speedo is because of the later tranny, the cable wouldnt fit anymore Could be. I haven't checked in the dash, but the cable is connected to the tranny. I run an app called Ulysses which uses the cell phone GPS to calculate speed, trip distance, and more. Very nice app. You can be in any program on the phone, and the speed will show up in a small round area of the screen, so there is no need to keep the Ulysses app open all the time. The only "problem" is the lack of self cancelling turn signals which has had me driving down the road with my turn signal on more times than I care to admit.. Sooner or later I'll get used to it! | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I ordered the Scarebird disc brake adapter and all the goodies to go along with it. Also ordered a pair of lower control arm bushings. The uppers had been replaced at some point. | ||
ttotired |
| ||
Expert 5K+ Posts: 8445 Location: Perth Australia | The self cancelling is probably a little tab thats on a ring pressed into the steering wheel boss broken I have the same fault with my wheel (wheels). I havnt worked out how exactly I am going to fix it yet, but probably macine up a new one. There was one on ebay a little while ago, but I let it go (no bids) I dont think the seller was willing to ship to over here anyway. | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | With the help of the guys on the Slant 6 forum I figured out why it was dying when coming to a stop after a long cruise. The carb adapter I have had two big unused ports on it. I had no idea what they were for. Turns out they are for coolant to flow through so the fuel mixture is heated before the turbo which helps keep the fuel atomized. I hooked up water to the ports and haven't had a problem since. Here are a few photos of the updated setup: Here's a few pics of the updated setup:
Edited by ab7fh 2013-03-26 8:16 PM | ||
mrtester |
| ||
Elite Veteran Posts: 802 Location: Norcross (Atlanta area), GA | PlymouthFury - 2013-03-14 12:22 PM The 4spd w/ overdrive most likely came out of a 70's era car/truck. Depending on the rear end it can be a really nice setup. Chrysler modified its A-833 four-speed manual, about 1976-77, into a three-speed-plus-overdrive unit. As such, this modified four-speed tranny first appeared in the F-body Volare/Aspen and was also used in the final 1976 Duster, most likely with the Feather Duster economy option group. The basic design of the transmission case is the same as the original, only the gears changed and possibly the mounting points as well. The 4-speed/OD was also used in full-size pickups and vans well into the 80s, eventually replacing the 3-speed on the column for all remaining rear-drive Mopars. Still the same old A-833, retuned for modern times. Working with a 3.23 rear, it really is a nice setup. | ||
56Fanatic |
| ||
Expert Posts: 1352 Location: Springville, CA | What they did to make an o/d out of the a833 was to change third gear, both the speed gera and the matching section of the cluster. Then they flipped the 3-4 lever on the tranny upside down. So, the 1:1 fourth became third and the overdriven third became fourth! | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I just finished up with my Scarebird front disc brake conversion. Of course nothing ever goes as planned when working on a 50 year old car. #1 I couldn't reuse the stock backing plate mounting bolts because the Dart uses Lockheed brakes which use longer bolts than the other Forward Looks. Picked up some grade 8 hardware. Problem solved. #2 I bought a small bore master cylinder for manual disc brakes at MATS. The master leaks and won't pressure the system Wanted to be sure that the problem wasn't elsewhere in the system, so I bought a 1" bore master at O'Reillys for less than 40.00. No problem now. The system holds pressure, the problem was the rebuilt master. The Scarebird bearing spacer is machined to very close tolerances and not a slip fit in my application. My work around for that was to heat the spacer in the oven for 10 minutes at 350. After that it slipped right on. My drums were out of round, causing the brake pedal to pulsate. That's almost gone, but I can still feel it a little bit from the rear brakes. The pulsation is barely perceptible now. The front end used to shudder when I applied the brakes hard. Now it just does exactly what it's supposed to. Night and day difference between the drums and the discs. Edited by ab7fh 2013-04-05 7:49 PM | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | This drive in restaurant is just up the road from me. Great place to cruise to. (screamers_lightened.jpg) Attachments ---------------- screamers_lightened.jpg (155KB - 265 downloads) | ||
oldwood |
| ||
Expert Posts: 2905 Location: little rock, AR | I was at a car show today and took these pics of a /6 turbo set-up. (001.JPG) (002.JPG) (003.JPG) (004.JPG) (005.JPG) Attachments ---------------- 001.JPG (191KB - 294 downloads) 002.JPG (169KB - 326 downloads) 003.JPG (176KB - 380 downloads) 004.JPG (179KB - 347 downloads) 005.JPG (185KB - 286 downloads) | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | Time for an update... The clutch went out on the slant six and I used that as my opportunity to start my engine swap. I am having a 318 poly built by Gary Pavlovich. Dual quad, .525 lift cam 390ci, should be fun! Since owning the car I have restored the trunk, and am now working on a rest of the engine compartment. Everthing from the firewall forward. I also pulled the dash to restore, and rewire the entire car. I want to make this car as reliable as it is good looking. Edited by ab7fh 2014-01-25 10:07 AM (1D7_2612_3.jpg) Attachments ---------------- 1D7_2612_3.jpg (112KB - 277 downloads) | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | .. (AlertSnapshot-(3).jpg) Attachments ---------------- AlertSnapshot-(3).jpg (54KB - 279 downloads) | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | .... (blasted_parts.jpg) Attachments ---------------- blasted_parts.jpg (86KB - 264 downloads) | ||
ttotired |
| ||
Expert 5K+ Posts: 8445 Location: Perth Australia | I am guessing that the turbo /6 is no more? I liked it because that was unique | ||
57Kelii |
| ||
Elite Veteran Posts: 692 Location: Los Angeles, California | He could always sell it to a user on the forum....use it to replace any low level FL with a a flathead 6. | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | ttotired - 2014-01-25 4:36 AM I am guessing that the turbo /6 is no more? I liked it because that was unique
I enjoyed driving it with the slant 6 even though it never ran well. It was a hell of a challenge to make that thing go down the road with it's 2.9x gears. It was dead before it came on the boost. I had tinkered with the setup since I bought it. It ran way better, but it still wanted to stall after a long drive. It wasn't reliable at all. I had pulled the turbo and checked everything external. Everything had been tweaked, and prodded, and it all ran great going down the road, but when it came to an idle it died. When I pulled everthing apart for the motor swap I looked inside the J pipe for the first time. What I saw could very well have been the cause of the problems. They took one pipe and inserted it into the other about 1/2" - 3"4 deep. It should have been butt welded. They created a huge restriction. To make matters worse, they had an EGT sensor in there that must be 1" in diameter and that takes up MOST of the space in the J pipe. I just shock my head, and set it all aside. I bought the car with a V8 swap in mind, just took a bit longer than expected. | ||
oldwood |
| ||
Expert Posts: 2905 Location: little rock, AR | I hate to see ya getting rid of the / but I understand your frustration. The Super 6 set up with Dutra dual exhaust is what a lot of the /6 guys go to. I have 2 Super 6 set ups but haven't put `1 on either of my /6 cars. I was thinking of putting 1 on my '61 Belvedere. | ||
bigears |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 203 Location: Christchurch, New Zealand | Like your Seneca .......... If you have the time would be really interested in a few pics of the V8 conversion as you work through the issues what's required etc. wouldn't mind attempting the same with mine one day ............... Cheers bigears | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I am working on a webpage for my Senecas. http://www.60dart.com I plan on putting all of the details on there as I go along. | ||
bigears |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 203 Location: Christchurch, New Zealand | Nice site I'll keep an eye out for updates ................... (Cheers.gif) Attachments ---------------- Cheers.gif (2KB - 278 downloads) | ||
cpd1212 |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 144 Location: Chicago, IL | What master cylinder did you use for the conversion? I'll be doing mine shortly. | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I used a Wilwood master cylinder with a 7/8" bore. | ||
lebaron |
| ||
Regular Posts: 56 | Hi, great looking car. What size tires are you running.They have the look I want on my Fury. | ||
58coupe |
| ||
Expert Posts: 1740 Location: Alaska | I have one of those 833 OD 4 speeds that is going in my 58 Plymouth behind a big block. there are at least 2 versions, one with an aluminum main case and one with cast iron. the iron case is stronger though slightly heavier. One weak point is the counter gear shaft can start spinning in the case and damage it. Because of the size of the gears inside, overall it is not as strong as a standard 833 but a company, www.passonperformance.com sells everything for these. | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | Updates on this build... (1D7_4340.jpg) (dash_wired.jpg) (engine_installation.jpg) (engine_installed.jpg) (front_brakeline.jpg) (front_right_brake.jpg) (OD_hole.jpg) (OD_hole3.jpg) (idler_arm.jpg) (pitman_arm.jpg) (s60.jpg) (fins_race.jpg) Attachments ---------------- 1D7_4340.jpg (172KB - 261 downloads) dash_wired.jpg (193KB - 264 downloads) engine_installation.jpg (228KB - 266 downloads) engine_installed.jpg (176KB - 269 downloads) front_brakeline.jpg (151KB - 262 downloads) front_right_brake.jpg (125KB - 268 downloads) OD_hole.jpg (205KB - 270 downloads) OD_hole3.jpg (223KB - 263 downloads) idler_arm.jpg (100KB - 264 downloads) pitman_arm.jpg (127KB - 272 downloads) s60.jpg (86KB - 281 downloads) fins_race.jpg (113KB - 264 downloads) | ||
cpd1212 |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 144 Location: Chicago, IL | Looks great. Inspires me to get the subframe in my 60 this weekend. | ||
d500neil |
| ||
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil! Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca | Rick, what brand-type of undercoating did you use, which was able to produce such a nice 3-D stand-up effect? | ||
ab7fh |
| ||
Veteran Posts: 172 Location: Aridzona | I used Herculiner and used the foam roller that it comes with. That's two coats, 10 minutes apart. | ||
d500neil |
| ||
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil! Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca | THANKS! | ||
fenix |
| ||
Expert Posts: 2120 Location: atlanta | I was going to tell you what a fantabulous car Ya have there till I noticed one cotter key not bent at the prescribed 125 degrees from vertical, so now it's only a fabulous car! :-) | ||
jimntempe |
| ||
Expert Posts: 2312 Location: Arizona | Did the cotter key at least have the correct plating on it? | ||
Jump to page : 1 2 Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page] |
Search this forum Printer friendly version E-mail a link to this thread |
(Delete all cookies set by this site) | |